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General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: stoney on Friday 20 April 07 19:23 BST (UK)
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With the Health and Safety "police" issuing edicts about the safety of gravestones spare a thought for those of us who, having already buried our parents once, are now "invited" to repeat part of the excercise by providing another headstone!
We fell foul of new regulations after a council-appointed "person" carried out a "topple-test" on our parent's headstone. True, the stone was tilting slightly by a couple of degrees but it was the concrete plinth in the soil that was tipping - the headstone itself was upright and was perpendicular to the base slab. Not satifactory enough for the good burghers of the local borough council - they actually manhandled it backwards off the concrete plinth to "prove" it was unsafe! (see pic)
The new regulations mean drilling through the original stone to insert an anchorage bar.
Fine.
Width of stone = approx 5cm. Width of bar = approx 3cm. You don’t need a degree in maths/science to assume that the stone will in all probability break, (as the funeral director herself suggested!) so the £275.75 we were quoted for this little excercise will be money down the drain and we will have to pay a further £900+ for a replacement stone!
....and I thought a headstone was supposed to last a lifetime! ::)
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Would it not be possible (and less expensive) to put in a new base for the existing headstone rather than their hideous suggestion?
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My thought exactly, but the "jobsworths" have decreed that if any stone is moved or changed for any reason (e.g. to add a new inscription) it has to be replaced in the manner of all new headstone - ie. with this anchorage bar system! :(
They say they're worried about a stone toppling over and hurting/killing someone - well unless your leaning on the stone it's hardly likely to move of it's own accord.
Funny, but when I looked around the cemetery this morning I noticed some great variations in angles of stones which for some reason have no hazard warning signs attached - I guess they don't care if someone gets killed by one of those!
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How many people have been killed by gravestones? This really is carrying things too far. It's probably the same mob that piled up all the old gravestones into one heap at my former parish church! What an unsightly mess they made. There was quite some discussion about this problem on an earlier thread.
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The likelihood is we'll have to stump up the cost for a new stone - but no matter how near we try to match it I think it will feel like we're visiting a different grave.
It's a bit like being bereaved all over again - I don't suppose the "jobsworths" give a fig about our feelings, they're just worried about lawsuits and compensation claims.
I have a solution for that - a one-line disclaimer on the noticeboard at the entrance to the churchyard - "The (whatever) Council accept no responsibility for injury due to falling headstones".
In fact, why don't all institutions employ such a disclaimer - then this "compensation culture" would have to stop blaming everyone else and take responsibility for their own actions!
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Can you choose who you want to do the repair? I know in some areas it has to be a "Council" sanctioned person.
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As i understand the regulations were brought in due to a child being killed by a headstone falling on them.
No one should have to go through such a tragic event.
Years ago when you had the big stone headstones they were put in by professional stone masons at the proper depth who knew their job and worked with the stone.
Now you get a headstone which is dressed and inscribed with a machine. These days anyone can set a business up as a monumental mason or buy a firm and can go do a course and get a certificate but they won't have the knowledge of the stone.
The other thing is in days gone by you didn't have all the heavy machinery / grasscutters disturbing the ground around the stones.
The base that they put down for headstones in my opinion is ridiculous and seems to be minimum specification.
The easiest way to rectify the problem (besides putting a deep enough base in) would be to drill the bottom of the headstones and the base and insert several steel rods.
Rewcastle
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Years ago when you had the big stone headstones they were put in by professional stone masons at the proper depth who knew their job and worked with the stone.
Rewcastle
The irony is my Mother's father was a Master Stonemason with a flourishing business in Carlisle (Beattie Bros.) - he would have known what he was doing! Well, we shall just have to cut our losses and put up a new stone to comply with all the new regulations. Trouble is, will they change the regulations again in 10 years time? ???
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Further to my tale of woe concerning my parents' headstone, I'm pleased to say we have found a stonemason who appears to know what he is doing and has a real love for his work.
He can make the necessary adjustments to comply with regulations and will do some restoration as well, for less than we were being quoted elsewhere! ;)
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Thats excellent stoney. Did you mention to him that your mothers father was a master stonemason? ;)
Rewcastle
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Thats excellent stoney. Did you mention to him that your mothers father was a master stonemason? ;)
Rewcastle
...oh yes!
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Further to my tale of woe concerning my parents' headstone, I'm pleased to say we have found a stonemason who appears to know what he is doing and has a real love for his work.
He can make the necessary adjustments to comply with regulations and will do some restoration as well, for less than we were being quoted elsewhere! ;)
As you can see from the date of today's posting, nearly 18 months has elapsed. The stone is STILL not sorted, despite many phone calls and visits to the stone mason! (He must be a VERY busy man!)
In desperation I searched the web for stonemasons in nearby towns who might be prepared to take on the necessary work.
I located one in Coventry - and here's a funny twist! It's owned by the same company that bought out my Grandad's stonemason business in Carlisle!
I'm awaiting a response - will let you know the progress! (but if it takes as long as the other bloke perhaps we ought to order OUR headstones, too, while we're at it!)
Do you think we might be able to get "mates-rates"?
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Further to my tale of woe concerning my parents' headstone, I'm pleased to say we have found a stonemason who appears to know what he is doing and has a real love for his work.
He can make the necessary adjustments to comply with regulations and will do some restoration as well, for less than we were being quoted elsewhere! ;)
As you can see from the date of today's posting, nearly 18 months has elapsed. The stone is STILL not sorted, despite many phone calls and visits to the stone mason! (He must be a VERY busy man!)
In desperation I searched the web for stonemasons in nearby towns who might be prepared to take on the necessary work.
I located one in Coventry - and here's a funny twist! It's owned by the same company that bought out my Grandad's stonemason business in Carlisle!
I'm awaiting a response - will let you know the progress! (but if it takes as long as the other bloke perhaps we ought to order OUR headstones, too, while we're at it!)
Do you think we might be able to get "mates-rates"?
Well, we didn't get "mates rates" but our new headstone was fitted last week and it looks superb, I have to say! (see the "before" and "after" piccies)
I'm just pleased it's all done and, split three ways between me and my siblings, the cost hasn't been extortionate.
And here's another twist - one of the men in the yard at Coventry (where the work was done) had worked at the old branch in Carlisle which was started by my grandfather and his brother! :o
Funny old world, isn't it! ;)
Stoney.
P.S. .....and now I hear that councils are being urged to stop doing "topple" tests on memorial stones partly because of a public backlash and also that the risk-factor had been grossly over-exagerrated in the first place! duh! ::)
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Some say Death is the end.....
....apparently not, where my parents are concerned.
If you look back up this thread you'll see the saga concerning my parents' headstone.
The previous entry to this suggested it was all done and dusted.
Alas, not so!
When I went up to put flowers at the grave at the weekend, coinciding with my Mum's birthday and Father's Day, I noticed the stone looked out of kilter. Although, given a lot of the other stones are at angles it was hard to tell if it was just a visual thing.
But my sister went up this morning, armed with a spirit-level - and yes, it was toppling forwards again!
I dug out the paperwork from 18 months ago and contacted the masons. They said until someone has been out to inspect the stone they can't comment. however, if there is subsidence they can re-set it - but there will be a charge! How much, I've no idea.
It just goes on and on and on! If the council had left the blessed thing alone it would have been perfectly alright.
And what's to stop the stone tilting again in another 18 months?
I've told our kids to have me cremated and they can please themselves what they do with the ashes! Sad isn't it - to think I come from a line of stonemasons and I don't want a headstone when I die!
Grrrrr! >:(
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How many people have been killed by gravestones? This really is carrying things too far. It's probably the same mob that piled up all the old gravestones into one heap at my former parish church! What an unsightly mess they made. There was quite some discussion about this problem on an earlier thread.
Regulations here in Ontario, Canada, require payment into a fund to maintain headstones in perpetuity. This was done after a headstone fell on a child visiting a cemetery and killed her. Apparently all members of the family were deceased, so there was no one to pay to fix the unstable headstone.
On another note, I paid a visit to my great-grandparents yesterday, and was horrified to discover the headstone broken off its base and lying on the ground. I've already made a phone call for a quote about having it cleaned, freshened up and uprighted. They're buried on hilly ground, so I guess it was only a matter of time.
Carol
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Yesterday, I found a message on the anserphone saying that the masons have been and readjusted the stone and there is to be no charge. :)
Mind you, I've yet to go and see for myself..... :-\