RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: audrey on Sunday 28 November 04 10:39 GMT (UK)
-
Hi
I really think we could do with a brick wall page where we could post stuff thats really got us bogged down like things that no matter where you try we cant fined the answer we all have them and they are so frustrating we could post them on the board and some one could volunteer to break it down in exchange for them taking one of some one else's
i hope that lot makes sense
Audrey
-
Oops wrong board sorry folk's I came on to cheer myself up and forgot where I was
Audrey
-
Makes sense to me Audrey ;D
I have two great grandfathers to swap for a start.
Darcy ;)
-
I ave never rad a brick wall ;) mine are Castle walls and they will be standing longer than i will ;D
Celia
-
I think mine are double reinforced and 3ft thick. Concrete lined and strengthened with steel rods. It seems absolutely ludicrous that Ive hit a brick wall as thick as this....
-
Mine rival the Berlin wall !
-
Some of mine are more like the Great Wall of China!
-
Any walls bigger than that ??
;D ;D ;D ;D
-
...maybe we need the "Jericho" approach, to get these walls down!
Pssst - anyone got a spare horn to blow? ;)
-
But im not going to give up!!!!
-
great grandfathers? can't even think about them til I can track
their 2 sons ,my grandfathers are the greatest wall builders of all time.
despite knowing lots about both their marriages and siblings ,plus addresses on certs.
1 marriage took place in dublin 1909,other grandad married
in dublin 1918.
have both their fathers names plus mothers first name for one
and maiden name for the other .the problem? they don't seem to
exist before marriages except both served in the army during the first world war.
as for creating brick walls,well both were listed as labourers in civilian life. ;D
anne
p.s. somewhere in dublin there is an adult baptism cert' for john as he converted to rc to marry my grandmother.
-
Oh dear! And I thought it was bad? Surely with most of that information you should be able to find it! I presume they are both Irish and ive heard nasty rumours about Irish records.
Is it really that bad to find Irish ancestors?
-
Well my story is similar. My 3x Grandfather, I know everything about him. Got his birth, marriage and death certificates.
His father lived next door in one particular census! Got his year of birth as he appears in a few census, place of birth and a year of his death! But no information at all in any sort of record about a birth or a marriage. Unless im not using Parish records properly (Could be as im a newcomer to this!), im completely stumped.
Wonder where he got his building materials for his wall ;D
-
He borrowed them from my Gr Grandfather in 1912 !
-
Sounds about right. Have you any pointers regarding delving into parish records? Any do's or dont's?
-
Oh dear! And I thought it was bad? Surely with most of that information you should be able to find it! I presume they are both Irish and ive heard nasty rumours about Irish records.
Is it really that bad to find Irish ancestors?
I don't think Irish records from the period we need are too bad,
its more to do with needing just that tiny piece of solid information
that will bring the walls down.my sister(celtic damsel) and I went to lombard street
in dublin last week to check the death indexes again but this time for john's parents
william and mary owens deaths.family legend says john was brought to dublin along with his family by his eldest brother at age 14 and was born in wales(pontypridd or swansea).the dublin indexes show only about four or five deaths for owens in each quarter and as some of these can be ruled out by age alone being either too young or too old.we bought a couple which seemed the most likely to be them and then went around to the dublin city library on pearse street to check newspapers for obits for the dates on these.succeeded in 'marrying the wrong william and mary as the mary we got was the widow of a man called martin!!we also had a few spare notes from the death indexes which is when I discovered that although I had noted the page and vol. number I had forgot to write down the year grr.
ah well,another visit to lombard street maybe next week might solve the mystery.my sister already visited wales a few years ago but without an actual address looking for owens in wales?more wrong certs.some posted on rootschat so maybe they might help somebody else some day.
regards.anne
-
Oh dear! And I thought it was bad? Surely with most of that information you should be able to find it! I presume they are both Irish and ive heard nasty rumours about Irish records.
Is it really that bad to find Irish ancestors?
I don't think Irish records from the period we need are too bad,
its more to do with needing just that tiny piece of solid information
that will bring the walls down.my sister(celtic damsel) and I went to lombard street
in dublin last week to check the death indexes again but this time for john's parents
william and mary owens deaths.family legend says john was brought to dublin along with his family by his eldest brother at age 14 and was born in wales(pontypridd or swansea).the dublin indexes show only about four or five deaths for owens in each quarter and as some of these can be ruled out by age alone being either too young or too old.we bought a couple which seemed the most likely to be them and then went around to the dublin city library on pearse street to check newspapers for obits for the dates on these.succeeded in 'marrying the wrong william and mary as the mary we got was the widow of a man called martin!!we also had a few spare notes from the death indexes which is when I discovered that although I had noted the page and vol. number I had forgot to write down the year grr.
ah well,another visit to lombard street maybe next week might solve the mystery.my sister already visited wales a few years ago but without an actual address looking for owens in wales?more wrong certs.some posted on rootschat so maybe they might help somebody else some day.
regards.anne
-
Ah, but Anne,
It might be OK if you can physically go to where the Irish records are. It's quite hopeless if you can't!! :( :( :( :(
And although there are a few Irish lines I am stopped on, because I can't get to appropriate records, my real Great Walls of China are in London. Two of them, mid nineteenth century. Two gggrandparents. And unless an unknown family member emerges from the mists to tell me what happened to these people, those walls will remain! :'( :'( :'(
MarieC
-
Oh dear! Have you thought about a holiday to Ireland to resolve this? Might be of some value to you (depending where you live now obviously).
-
hey iv got huge walls like the rest of you, many of which will remain im sure for some years to come yet! However iv found that the following tools are extremely valuable in wall demolishing:
a) A LOT of persistance and willingness to go to any lengths to solve it - even things you wouldnt normally do like knocking on strangers doors for example. Also if you try doing something and it doesnt work first time you need to keep trying - yes you will annoy people lol but you need to be like that to knock down great walls of china!!
b) you need to accept that you're probably not going to solve it fully in the near future - but you might make tiny steps which all help in the end. You need to be satisfied with that and keep having a stab once a year or so - if it still seems impossible even with new angles then just try again in a few months time.
c) When your family have no/limited knowledge on the person/matter in question you need to seriously - and i mean persistenly look elsewhere such as googling with "..." and particularly every few months re search Genes Reunited and contact ANY - i repeat ANY possible relations! I found a man who had been researching my family for 30 years in this way - all i entered was an adress that my family lived at in 19th century! Iv knocked down many BIG brick walls this way - bit its very important to KEEP searching every few months cos things appear online all the time.
d) you need to think AROUND obstacles and accept that going a log way out of your way and sometimes onto a completely different line to solve something about an ancestor. Googling not only names but also known addresses is often a good 'wall basher'.
e) also accept that money goes a long way in wall bashing - sometimes its just better to cut to the chase and spend a few pounds rather than waste another few years searching - for instance to find living or recently deceased relatives (or indeed to find out if theyre still alive) use traceline - yes it costs but you can have an answer in 5 working days...also National archives and other archives - searches cost but save up and it will be worth it in the end.
f) Its important to give your brain a rest from one major 'line of enquiry cos you begin to not be able to see the wood for the trees. Fresh mind tackles things in new ways and looks at more obscure records and thinks round things better.
g) ask questions to older rellies before theyre gone - and show them photos - theyre the only link you may ever have - once theyre gone theyre gone!
Iv just solved a huge brickwall which people have always told me I would NEVER do - they were telling me that just a matter of weeks ago.
A lot of the battle is belief that one day you will solve it. Be persistant and think round problems and always asking other rellies that you have found on the net. Thats my key to the bit of success iv had.
Hope that helps.
Dont be defeated!
Alison
-
ps i think if we could 'trade' brick walls on rootschat it would be great!
Alison
-
Lots of excellent advice Alison. Ways you suggest have worked for me ... like thinking sideways; keeping going back to old sites which get updated; putting requests on all the boards like Rootsweb ... 1% get answered, if you are lucky, but its that lucky one that you are waiting for. And of course, what better than RootsChat !!
I'm now waiting (im)patiently for the 1911 and 1921 censuses ... if I live that long ! But even so, if I don't, then my notes and where I've got to might help one of my children or grandchildren to continue the search. Think large time scale on this one !
-
Some very good points there Alison! Persistance is the key. Sadly, the persistance here is slowly wearing thin!
Older relatives do not know, and I have nobody else to turn to.
AARRGGGGGGGHHHHH!!!!
-
Hi all
Now what you need is a nice story of how brick walls come tumbling down to cheer you all up.
So here goes.
Like most people i could trace my gg aunt through her birth marriage and death.
But could i find any info on her siblings NO.
I had info on 7 of them but new there was more, but no matter where i looked brick walls all round.
Then out of the blue i got a letter from my great aunt saying that a member of that family had been to see her, by chance and she was interested in the family tree, and wanted info,
Well we meet for the first time ever 2 weeks ago and wow i have more info than i know what to do with now.
By the way the family i was looking for was called SMITH
and i have waited 25 years for this info.
So never give up.
William James
-
That is encouraging, William! And I will need a relative to appear out of the blue to solve mine! I have done all of what is suggested above, as far as possible, but I am one of those who left it too late to ask a couple of the oldies who might have known some things I need to find!
And Vasquez, since I am in Australia, a holiday in Ireland is not too easy to organise! Maybe some time in the future...
MarieC
-
Yes! That is such good news and very encouraging! There is hope for us all.
Marie, have you any contacts in Ireland that could do some searching for you?
-
Vasquez,
A very kind Rootschatter did some searching for me a couple of years ago, and I also paid an Irish researcher an obscene amount of money to do a little more. (Irish researchers charge like wounded bulls!! :'( :'( ) I don't have anyone now who could do any looking.
I did post on the Dublin board to see if anyone could look for a headstone in the Mount Jerome cemetery, but unfortunately no answers so far!! :'( :'(
It is extremely difficult to do research in Ireland unless you physically go there, or unless you pay megabucks to a researcher. And the one I had left a little to be desired. :(
MarieC
-
Hi All,
There is a Brick Wall thread here:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,38634.0.html
You need to post a link to a thread elsewhere on rootschat with the details of the brick wall so that the replies don't appear on the brick wall thread as it would get too big.
Jean
-
hi mariec,
I have seen your request before for someone to look for a gravestone in mount jerome.its a rather large cemetery and a lot of the old stones could be unreadable and also to look for a grave you would need some idea of the section it is likely to be in or you could be there forever!
have you thought of contacting the office in mount jerome if you have at least a year of death?other things to consider is the fact that there may not be a gravestone at all especially if the grave was not 'bought out' at the time.
I do visit family graves there and have looked through some photos I took there recently in the old sections but don't see the name you are looking for.
if at some stage you manage to get at least the plot number I will try to find it and take a photo for you.
regards.anne
-
Not to put a dampener on our desires to break down our brick walls but I sometimes think not all walls are meant to be broken down. For example, all those war service records destroyed in WW1 after the British War Office was bombed is my particular brick wall that nothing will penetrate as the docs are lost forever. Or all the books and official documents burnt in Nuremburg, Germany that would of been invaluable to people of Jewish descent. And how about our own ancestors who may have destroyed letters or docs to protect themselves or others. Queen Victoria's daughter destroyed all her letters after she died at her request. There are probably many others that have been lost in history too. :'(
Makes you want to cry!
Bron
-
have you thought of contacting the office in mount jerome if you have at least a year of death?other things to consider is the fact that there may not be a gravestone at all especially if the grave was not 'bought out' at the time.
I do visit family graves there and have looked through some photos I took there recently in the old sections but don't see the name you are looking for.
if at some stage you manage to get at least the plot number I will try to find it and take a photo for you.
regards.anne
Hi Anne
Thank you so much for your offer!
The trouble is (and I have just done a second Google search to make sure I didn't miss it the first time) that there doesn't appear to be a website or an email address for Mt Jerome cemetery. It is what I looked for first.
However, I have now discovered that the good old LDS have filmed burial records at Mt Jerome, so I can order in the relevant film to my local LDS and hope that it has the required information.
If it does, I will pm you with the plot information. It may take a little while to order and read this film.
I really appreciate your help with this!
Regards,
MarieC
-
I can't find William Trotter of Scotland's mother and father. Or his wife Caroline Dill's mother and father. He was born about 1699 or 1700 in Scotland. And his wife was born about 1703 in Slinford, Sussex, England. They married their in 1724 had a son named James Trotter Sr. their the next year and then moved to Brunswick County, Virginia( in the United States). Once in the U.S. they had 2 more kids named Phillip Trotter and Nancy Trotter.
-
muddinmom,
Welcome to Rootschat! :D
Have you popped a post about this on the Scottish boards? If not, do try. Somebody may be able to help you there.
MarieC
-
Yes and I've gotten no replys.
-
Oh dear - that's a shame, muddinmom. Unusual for Rootschat - usually there are people trying to help!
I'll try to make some suggestions - not sure if you've already done any of this but you will tell me if you have!
I'm not researching in Scotland, because most of my lot have been researched and written up, but I believe scotlandspeople is a very good website. Have you bought credits and searched there? From memory I think you make a relatively small outlay on credits, perhaps five pounds' worth, which would probably allow you to search comprehensively for your Scottish folk.
As for your Sussex folk - have you posted on the Sussex board here? Have you searched the IGI for them (and the Scottish ones)? As you know where Caroline Dill was born, you should be able to identify the parish her family belonged to. If the LDS has filmed the parish registers of that parish, you could order in to your local LDS Family History Centre, for a very moderate price:
1. A film of baptisms covering the year 1703, which should give you her parents' names if you find her baptism;
2. A film of marriages covering the years around 1703. If you find her parents' marriage, it will give you her mother's maiden name, which you are unlikely to get from Caroline's baptism record.
Then you can try to push backwards from there.
MarieC
-
I'll take a look now :)
Gadget
-
Hi all - muddinmom's query about the Trotters is also on these threads - knowing this might save duplication of efforts :)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,248792.0.html now locked
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,248988.0.html now locked
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,248786.0.html
* Moderator Comment: If anybody can help, then please answer on the topic on the Sussex board to avoid duplication of efforts. Thanks :)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,248786.0.html
-
I can't find anything to do with my Great Great Grandarents William Dwyer and his wife Bridget (nee Calland).
There's dispute as to where they came from in Ireland (some say Kildare, some say Wexford, Waterford or Wicklow), on the census' over here they just put 'Ireland' in the 'Where Born' category.
There's big discrepancies in the year William was born (anytime between 1861 and 1868) and Bridget's maiden name doesn't appear to exist in any of the searches I've done on Irish websites etc.
Like a previous poster said - Irish websites charge like wounded rhino for searches, and the one site I thought could help me wanted £145 for the honour, money I just don't have being on a limited income :( .
It would mean so much to me to find out about him, as it's tracing my own family name. I think the best I can hope for is that on the 1911 census he's put either the county or town in Ireland he and Bridge-y babes where born in which would help, but I (and everyone else) are going to have to wait yonkers to get our mitts on the census returns.
ok, moan over ;)
-
Cavegirl- have you found their marriage yet? If in Ireland it should give names (and occupations) of both fathers.
Civil registration of births in Ireland began 1864 and became compulsory in 1870 so there may not be a birth certificate for William. To search for baptism you need to know religion, area (parish if not townland not just a county) and then find out if the church records still exist for the period you need.
-
Don't forget to keep checking Free BMD.or Ancestry etc.where it's relevant.I tend to forget that it is being updated all the time.
I have a rellie born in 1855, last sighting on Census in 1881. No more info. on any other site,so she got brickwalled.(two years ago)
Had contact two days ago with a GR member and decided to have another look for missing rellie. Tonight I found her marriage on Free BMD and Census return for 1891!! (with Children too)
One down and many more to go!!
Spring
-
hi all,well the 'brick wall has been breached' ;D, see page one of this topic
a lovely rootschatter found g'dad john owens army papers.
my sister and I now have place of birth and year plus new name for his mother
which is sarah ann,no maiden name for her yet but a couple more addresses
for her to check.after all the time spent looking for him in wales it turns out
he was born in st peters parish in dublin city.rootschatters for ever,yippee!!
anne
-
Goodonya, Anne!
I'm delighted for you and your sister. Just shows that what goes round comes round! You had good karma heading your way after your kindness to me. I agree, Rootschatters for ever! If we all go on helping each other, we'll crash through most of our brick walls eventually!
MarieC
-
aw,thanks marie .b.t.w. I should be in touch with you
by later today or tomorrow regards remaining info'.
best wises.anne
-
Cavegirl- have you found their marriage yet? If in Ireland it should give names (and occupations) of both fathers.
Civil registration of births in Ireland began 1864 and became compulsory in 1870 so there may not be a birth certificate for William. To search for baptism you need to know religion, area (parish if not townland not just a county) and then find out if the church records still exist for the period you need.
Hi there
I'm sorry for not replying sooner - only just spotted this.
I haven't found their marriage yet, I was trying to do it through the UHF but they wanted £145 which I couldn't and still can't afford :(.
I've checked Ancestry and FreeBMD, but nothing so far.
One site charged me £25 and led me on a wild goose chase with it which I wasn't impressed about >:(.
I know they came to Wigan sometime before 1891 and were married when they were over here - their first child Bridget was born in 1886 I think and was born in Wigan - so they were possibly married before then and in Ireland, but when and where I've no idea as they didn't state where they were from on the census records.
Thank you for the heads up an sorry for not responding to your kind help sooner...
cavey
x