RootsChat.Com
Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: Matt R on Monday 19 March 07 19:08 GMT (UK)
-
Hi all, Im on the hunt of a Bernatrd Owens in the 1901 census, either living in Anderston, Barony or Holytown. He may even have been away at sea, he had a wife xcalled Lizzie. Bernard would be close to the age of 30 in 1901, he was born in Ireland if that helps. Lizzie would have been the same age roughly, but I dont know her birthplace. I know bernard's occupation was something to do with the sea.
Also, Im on the lookout for the family of Bernard and Susan McCartney, possibly in Cambuslang, if not, somewhere around that part of Lanarkshire.
I appreciate the info is lacking a wee bit, but Id appreciate any help
Regards
Matthew
-
Hi Matthew
Susan and Bernard McCartney:
1901 654 ED 22 page 12
30 Stonelaw St, Rutherglen
Bernard, 30, siewer(?) in Tube Works, b. Cambuslang
Susan, w, 25, weaver, b. Rutherglen
Bernard,s, 8, b. Rutherglen
James, s, 6, b. Rutherglen
Susan, d, 4, b. Rutherglen
If no one has looked for the others, I'll look later this evening.
Gadget :)
-
Hello again Matthew
Not much luck with Bernard (or Lizzie!) but I've found a few Elizabeths. To help narrow down the search, would they have had any children?
Is Lizzie, Eliza Fox or Elizabeth Carey?
Gadget
-
Hi Gadget, thanks for the lookups, Im not sure to be hoenst. All I have on them is what Ive written, I'll look and see if I can find Bernard's death certifiacte, it may be signed by one of his kids. Other than that, I cant be sre, sorry!
Matthew
P.S If naming patterns are anything to go by, children may have been Bernard, Elizabeth, Lizie, Mary Ann, John, William, Ann, Peter, Ellen, Bridget. Other than that Im sfraid this family are very elusive.
-
Hi gadget, Ive just reread your message. Bernard Owens married Elizabeth Carey, but his father was called Bernard Owens, who was married to Eliza Fox.
So Bernard Owens, amrried Eliza Fox in Ireland. Their son was Bernard, who is the one Im after. He married Elizabeth Carey. Both Bernards are hot on my lookup list!!
Matthew
-
Hi again Matthew
So I don't have to use any of my units~
What have you got on both the Bernard families, apart from what you say here?
Have you got them in the earlier censuses?
If so, where?
What age was the elder Bernard and his wife?
Have you got details of the Owens/Carey marriage?
Regards
Gadget
-
Hi, Ive checked to see earlier cenus' but nothing concrete, the family were still in Ireland at this point. I have Bernard and Elizabeth CAREY'S marrige certificate, dated April 1889, when he was 19. He was a sailmaker at the time.
Elder Bernard was born in Ireland, could be anywhere Im currently writing to parishes Ive narrowed it down to!
He married Eliza Fox there around 1860 and had kids Mary Ann, Peter (died 1865-69, Ireland), Eliza or Lizzie, Catherine, Ellen, John, Bernard, Joseph.
Eliza or Lizzie married a James Carey, this is confusing as her brother Bernard married an Elizabeth Carey (!)
Before that though she had been married to James Rice, they had two kids in the 1901 census, Patrick and Mary Ann.
Mary Ann is my g g granny. She married Francis McDonald in 1885, he died in 1889 and she remarried to Irishman Michael Hughes in 1894. He died in 1911 and Mary Ann died 1941 aged 79.
Ellen married twice too! First to a William Chamberlain, and then to a man called Donnachie, dont know his frirst name. It would be interesting to see if I can there marriage certs on scotlandspeole.
The family is quite complicated there are a lot of deaths and remarryings going on!
Catherine married Charles McMillan on March 10 1880 in Belfast.
John apparently never married, relative tells me he died in Cleland hospital, after 1931
Finally Bernard married Elizabeth Carey (dont know if shes any relation to Elizabeth Owens' husband James Carey)
The youngest child of Bernard Owens and Eliza Fox was Joseph. He married Rose McGinty.
Annotingly I cant find any of their kids in the censuii because they did not marry until 1903!!
Bernard the elder died in Kelvin Glasgow in June 1884 aged 44. Im told by the family he died on the crossing from Ireland to Scotland, his cause of death was acute pneumonia, he died in Galsgow Western Infirmary.
After Bernard's death his wife Eliza Fox remarried to John Devanny in 1892. I dont know when he died but Eliza died 1915 aged 75, in Holtown.
There are alot of gaps in thuis branch of the family. Thats moreorles all I have, the rest is what the family tell me, I have know their info to be edited over the years!!!
If theres anything you dont understand, let me know, I apologise I havent exactly explined it clearly!
Regards Matthew
-
Hi Matthew!!
You have forgotten that there was another Peter Owen (I will call him Peter II) born to this family. Peter I died as you stated which is correct and confirmed by me.
Hope you can look for Peter II in Scottish censuses.
Cheers,
Tees
-
Thanks this is so confusing there are so many people to keep track of!
Peter II does not apear with parents on 1891/1901 census so he was married with own family. Now I just have to hunt him down!!
-
Thanks for all that Matthew. I'm going to print it out and study it, making charts as I go. You have lots of dificult ones there ::)
Just one more thing - what did it say for Elizabeth Carey on the arriage cert - age, occupation, etc.
Thanks - I'll be back :)
Gadget
PS - Hello Tees - thanks for the extra bit of info
-
Hi Gadhet, my family being as elusive as they are, the marriage on scotlandspeole is stupidly difficult to read. From what I can see, Elizabeth Carey was 19 at time of marriage, Bernard was 18. She lived at time of marriage at 53 Richard Street Glasgow (note most of the Owens family had or were still living at this street at various times betwen 1884-1956). The certificate is really difficult to read Ive tried to attach the certificate dont know if it will work though :-\
Elizabeth's parents were Patrick Carey and Hannah O'Neil.
If the certificate doesnt work could I have your email perhaps I could post it and you can take a look for me, but it is really difficult to make out!
Regards
Matthew
I really appreciate all those who are helping me with this, the info in particular provided by Tees and Gadget has helped me alot. Thanks Guys!
-
Thanks Matthew
i've downloaded it and will try and enhance it - it's pretty faint as you say.
I might not be back to you until tomorrow but I'll be having a good rummage around for them :)
Gadget
-
Hi Matthew!
You are more than welcome!! Actually, it is my pleasure to help you out! ;D
Hullo there, Gadget! Always such a delight to see you helping other people--you are great at finding people in the censuses...even in the certificates!! (Matthew, you are fortunate to have her help! ;D ;D She actually found my elusive great-aunt's birth cert on Scotlandspeople under slightly different form of her first name! Brought all of my granny's family together--a complete set of siblings.)
Matthew, you can E-mail the Scotlandspeople to ask if they could send you a better photocopy of this certificate. They did oblige me with my wee request some time ago. Quite friendly site!
Have a happy searching on the Scotlandspeople!!
Cheers,
Tees
-
Hi Tees, Gadget sounds like your a woman of endles talent :P ;) Whilst Im on the subject I hope you dont mind Gadget if I ask for one wee request certificate wise, because I cant seem to find this despite searching on sP for a while now. Looking for the marriage certificate of William Ross and Alexandrina McLeod, probably in Ross and Cromarty :)
Thankyou Tees also, its great to have people like you that can actually find these things out. Ive been doing my tree for 8 months now-Ive managed to make my Family Tree that now totals 2054 people! So not doing bad. Trouble is, I have off times as Im studying for my A Levels aswell, so this is turning into a hobby more than a one off thing! Its addictive, you cant know where youre going unles you know where youre from, trouble is, Im from everywhere!!!
Regards
Matthew
-
Hi Matthew
The more you search, the more you find that you're from everywhere - I certainly am :D
I'll have a look at the Ross McLeod one for you but I think I looked and possibly found an Alexa - I'll check and if I find anything, I'll put it on that thread.
While I'm about it, did Bernard, junior and Elizabeth have any children in Scotland?
Good luck with A levels - I did mine (5 or 6) 43-44 years ago 8) 8) 8)
Gadget :)
-
Hi Matthew,
Good luck with your "A" Levels!!
Best wishes,
Tees
-
Thanks!!
I got the first results back last Thursday, I was three marks off an A in RS and four off an A in history!! Annoying but Im still pleased. I have a huge Psychology one in 6 weeks!!!!
So if you dont hear from me I'll be hard working on Sigmund Freud ;D
Hopefully, the plan is to go into politics and sort things out, so to speak, or I can at least try cant I?
Matthew
-
Matthew
I think that we might be making some progress ~
Anderston
30th March 1889, Glasgow Maternity Hospital:
Bernard Owens, illegitimate
Father - Bernard Owens, cart cover maker (journeyman)
Mother - Elizabeth Carey, lithographic printers worker, dom - 53 Richard St, Glasgow
Anderston
26th June 1893
John Owens (district of birth - Blackfriars, Glasgow)
Father - Bernard Owens, steam ship stoker, domic - 48 Clyde Street, Anderston
Mother - Elizabeth m.s. Carey
Gadget :)
-
Matthew, Gadget & Tees,
I had a look at 1881 census and there is a Bernard Owens 55 yo born in Ireland 1826, he was a Quay Labourer, with wife, Mary Ann Owens at 54 yo, also born in Ireland staying at 6 Clyde Street, Glasgow. May not be the same ones you are looking for but wife's names is quite common in the family.
Keep up the search.
Tom
-
Hello again Matthew
I've found Elizabeth Carey's father on the 1901:
644/10 ED 4/10 page 16
51 Piccadilly Street, Anderston
Patrick, 60, mar, foundry lab, b. Ireland
Hannah, d, s, 26, b. Ireland
Francis, s, s, 22, machine borer, b. Glasgow
Edward, grandson, 3, b. Glasgow
hannah granddaughter, 3, b. Glasgow
No sign of Hannah senior in Scotland either - but Patrick is down as married not a widower. I'm now thinking that she might be in the same place as Lizzie - maybe Ireland :-\
Gadget
-
Hi all, thanks for the info you are a great help.
To Gadget, Bernard is illegitimate?
Just to clear that up a bit, Elizabeth had an affair?
Thats shocking, they are the last branch of the family Id expect to find that in to be honest!
Well, suppose these things cant be buried as long as nosey teenagers are on the ancestral prowl!! ;D
-
Hi All Sorry to butt in on your topic, I have Lanarkshire Owens's in my tree, I was wondering if there was any connection as I have been round in circles with them for years. I have Peter Owens married Catherine Johnston in Ireland. They had 4 children that I know of Peter, John, Thomas my G.G Granda and Janet. I think Thomas was born about 1844 in Lanarkshire. Catherine's parents were John Johnstone and Janet White as I found Catherines death cert 13/05/1862 in Old Monkland. Unfortunately no sign of Peter's. Any help or suggestions would be most appreciated.
Thanks Maz
-
Hi Maz, no problem at all, any bits of info appreciated, asd this side of the family dont like being discovered. My Owens' lot stem from Ireland too, but moved later, around 1884. They did live in Glasgow first, then Holytown. I dont know who Peter married, their were two Peter Owens' . The first died in infancy in Ireland, before 1869, and the second was born in 1869, in County Down. He would have been around 13 when he moved to Scotland, if he did-I cant find any trace of him in Scotland so far. I do hope he did not die too, that would be awful
Regards
Matthew
-
Hi Matthew, The Owens family certainly don't like being discovered. I think I found Peter Owens death cert but guess what? He died the year after Catherine died and the year before his son Peter married and he died in the poor house in Motherwell and no one knew his parents to put them on death cert lol just my luck. I have been doing this side of my tree for about 6 years with my dad and when he passed I continued as he didn't know much about his side as his dad died young and his grandfather was lost in action in WW1 only to turn up last year when I found a lady in Australia, He had jumped ship and started a whole new life and family, which was bad then but now I have an extended family in Oz lol. I was thinking of a trip to Ireland but have no idea where to start as there as been no mention of where in Ireland they may have originated from. Thanks for your reply Maz
-
Hi Maz
Im off to Ireland in August, I can look up any info for you if you wish, or find out where your branch are from.hy
My Owens family are from Clonavaddy, Tyrone, and Down.
Other names on my Owens side include McMillan, McGinty, Carey, Fox, Hughes and McDonald
-
Hi Matthew thank you very much for your kind offer. Down has come up in a few family conversations. Peter's son Peter married a Margaret McMillan parents Hugh McMillan and Margaret (Dougan?) cant really make out her second name. I know Peter and Catherine Johnston were married before coming to Scotland and I have Catherines parents names if it helps . Maz
-
Hello Gadget, thanks they are still going...well...lol.
Can I ask of you a favour? Im looking for a mother and son in the 1891 for Lanarkshire. Mary Ann McDonald (widowed) and her son Francis, he'd be about 1. They may be in Anderston district, Glasgow, from the birth, death certs Ive gathered, Id suggest they would be in Richard Street, Glasgow.
Regards,
Matt :)
-
Hi Matt
Just arrived in the far North after two days in Glasgow and one on Skye. I'll check things out for you tomorrow if that's OK - travel weary and suffering from 'weather' ;D
My line keeps going down with each gust - taken me 4 goes to post this :(
Gadget
Just noticed that Monica is on - I'm sure she'll jump in ;D
-
Hello Gadget of course no worries I can wait. Stay safe!!!
Matt x
-
Hi Matt
Could you give me some details about Mary Ann - place of birth, age, etc., please
I'm having probs locating them at the moment, even using various options.
Gadget
Scrub this query - I've been looking at 1901 ::) ::) ::) Think i took it from your subject line :-[
-
Might this be them:
77 Piccadilly Street, Anderston
Reg Dist 644/10 ED 9 page 12
Eliza Fox or Owens, wid, 47, b. Ireland
Mary Ann Owens, dau, wid, 27, laundry worker, b. Ireland
Joseph, son, 11, scholar, b. Ireland
Frank McDonald, grandson, 2, b. Lanarkshire, Glasgow
Regards
Gadget :)
-
Wooo this is them Gadget. Thankyou!!! The Ireland questuion is bugging me now. Its such a shame the records are gone :-\
Thanks again youre a star!
Matthew.
-
Glad that I could help, Matt :)
I'm just no good on Ireland though :-\ Do you have any idea of County or Townlands that they came from - say from Mary Ann's marriage cert. for example.?
Gadget
-
Sorry Gadget the marriage certs for Mary Ann doesnt give place of birth. The thing is, I have traced siome of her siblings, they were born in two different counties! I have County Tyrone and County Down. I think the family moved east and then over to Scotland, juding from the geography. I cant place Mary Ann because she was born before compulsory registration, it seems literally a few months before it was introduced for Catholics.
I dont even have a starting place to look for parishes. I have a feeling her family just wandered around the island looking for work. The time period would be 1860-1871. I have found the family in Downpatrick but a decade after Mary Ann was born.
To confuse things even more, the family say she was either born in Armagh or Down, but Im taking that with a pinch of salt!
Matt :) apologies for the essay!
-
Just looking through this thread again - it was a year ago :o :o :o
In one of your messages you asked for info on:
Looking for the marriage certificate of William Ross and Alexandrina McLeod, probably in Ross and Cromarty
Did you find them at all?
Gadget
-
Doesnt time fly when you are having fun, lol.
Thankyou I did manage to get hold of the certificate.
William Ross married Alexandrina McLeod June 26 1863 in Edderton, Ross and Cromarty. Her parents were John McLeod and Isabel McLean.
Williams parents were Andrew Ross and Ann Polson.
;)
-
Hi Matthew, How are you ;)
I will be in touch soon I dont have all my family tree stuff yet but will let you know as soon as I have it all. Still living out of boxes :D
Still no further on with any of mine yet either..
Maz
-
I'm fine thanks, yourself? Ive just came back from Auschwitz...adjusting back to life here ;) Quite a tough experience to get through though.
Hope you and family are all well. Have a good Easter!
Matt :) x