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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Montgomeryshire => Wales => Montgomeryshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: astley on Friday 09 February 07 15:18 GMT (UK)

Title: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: astley on Friday 09 February 07 15:18 GMT (UK)
This isn't really a request as such.  I just want to know if my ancestor matches anyone elses as she goes missing after 1861.

Margaret Astley was born in 1838 in Llanwnog.  Her parents are Evan & Martha Astley.  I have traced her in the 1841, 51 & 61 censuses.  In 1861 she is a servant in Carno.  But cannot find her in 1871,81,91 or 1901 censuses.  I have searched marriages for her and deaths but to no avail. There is another Margaret Astley in 1871 born in the same year but it is not her as there were two Margaret Astleys born in 1838.

Does anyone have her in their family tree and know her whereabouts after 1861?
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Friday 09 February 07 15:52 GMT (UK)

According to the Rootschat Surname Interest Table the following member is researching the name ASTLEY from Montgomeryshire:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=16911

You can contact him via the PM system.


If you like I can have a look for Margaret in 1871 onwards.......will get back to you shortly.

Jan
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Friday 09 February 07 15:57 GMT (UK)
Just want to make sure that I'm looking at the right Margaret in the earlier census.

In 1861 where she's a Servant - is it the one who is a Servant for another Astley family in Aberhafesp, or have I got the wrong one?!!!!!!

Also, there are a couple of possibilities in each census.  Have you got her birth certificate which confirms her parents?

Jan


Edit: Just noticed that you have already said she was a servant in Carno in 1861.  I missed that!!!!!
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: astley on Friday 09 February 07 18:38 GMT (UK)
Thanks for your reply.

I have been in touch with John Ashley last year but he couldn't give any more information.

Regarding your second message, I have found her baptism on the mormon site as being born in 1838 in Llanwnog with Evan & Martha Astley as her parents.  In 1841 she is 3 living in the Parish of Carno, in 1851 she is the a servant in carno [sorry I said this was in 1861 it isn't].  In 1861 she is with her Uncle's family anf her borthers working as a servant. In 1858 she gives birth to my great great grandad Thomas Astley.
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Friday 09 February 07 19:22 GMT (UK)

OK, thanks!!!

I can see Margaret with her family in 1841.

In 1851 I can see a Margaret as a Servant, of the right age, in Trawscoed, Upper Llanidloes.  Birthplace is shown as Carno, Montgomeryshire.  I don't think this is the right one???  Have you got the full reference for the 1851 please?

In 1861 she is with another Astley family (her brother Jeremiah is there also), but where is her son Thomas???  He would be about 3 years old.

Ah!!! I have just answered my own question ;D  Here he is in 1861 with his grandparents:-

RG9/4247 Folio 54 Page 8
Bronhaul, Esgob & Castle, Montgomeryshire


Evan Astley Head Mar 54 Ag Lab born Montgomeryshire Penegoes
Martha Astley Wife Mar 46 born Montgomeryshire Llandinam
John Astley Son 13 Farmers Boy born Montgomeryshire Carno
Elizabeth Astley Dau 11 Scholar born Montgomeryshire Carno
Ann Astley Dau 9 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog
Richard Astley Son 7 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog
Martha Astley Dau 5 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog
Susan Astley Dau 4 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog
Sarah Astley Dau 1 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog
Thomas Astley Grandson 2 born Montgomeryshire Llanwnog


Have you got your GG Grandfather's birth certificate? 

Jan
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Friday 09 February 07 19:44 GMT (UK)

I have found Margaret's birth on the North Wales BMD - Llanwnog 1838

Click this link http://www.rootschat.com/links/0189/ which will be a form for you to print off, complete the remaining details, and post to the Newtown Register Office with your fee!!!

When it arrives post the details here ;)

Jan
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: astley on Friday 09 February 07 20:09 GMT (UK)
Thanks for your replies.

I do not need a copy of her birth certificate as I know her parents are Evan & Martha from the IGI and the censuses [1841].

That is the correct Margaret Astley in 1851.

Yes I do have her son Thomas Astley's birth certificate and there is no father named on it.  Just his mothers name Margaret and it also says that her son was born st bronhaul so this links her with her family. He is on the BMD under surname Ashtley.  It was just by chance I found his birth on it.

I just would love to know what happened to her after the 1861 census as I cannot find a death or marriage for her.
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Saturday 10 February 07 14:54 GMT (UK)
Hello again :)

Quote
Yes I do have her son Thomas Astley's birth certificate and there is no father named on it.  Just his mothers name Margaret and it also says that her son was born st bronhaul so this links her with her family.

That confirms we have the right family in 1861 - hurray ;D

I'm going to have a good search for Margaret in the later census, in the meantime do you have all the census info for Thomas?.  If not, I can post the details here.

Jan


p.s. The family have moved from Bronhaul by the 1871 census, I checked the image and see that a Jones family are there.  So, I wonder where they went ???
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: astley on Saturday 10 February 07 16:44 GMT (UK)
Hi Jan

The Astley family are still at Bronhaul in 1871.  It is just that their surname was mistranscribed and is down as pastley.  They are still at Bronhaul, that is Evan, Martha, daughter Eleanor and grandaughters Amelia and Elizabeth but no Margaret.  I have searched for Margaret is the 1871,81,91 and 1901 censuses but cannot find her.  I did find another Margaret Astley with the same date of birth but it is not the Margaret I am looking for as there were two Margaret Astleys born in the same area at the same time.

Thanks for your help and if you come across her let me know.
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Saturday 10 February 07 17:55 GMT (UK)
I discovered them as Pastley too!!!! You beat me to it ;D ;D

I'm beginning to wonder if she did marry, and without being able to find a record of it we will never to whom >:(

I enjoy a challenge so I will see what I can find :D

Jan


P.S.  I've just had a thought
Quote
I do not need a copy of her birth certificate as I know her parents are Evan & Martha from the IGI and the censuses [1841].
  you will need it if you want to find out Martha's maiden name and go back another generation ;) ;)

Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Sunday 11 February 07 19:11 GMT (UK)

Have you got a copy of Thomas' marriage certificate?  Who is recorded on there as his father?

I thought that if there was a step-father's name then it might lead us to Margaret.


Jan
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: astley on Sunday 11 February 07 21:08 GMT (UK)
You'll be sorry you asked as it gets even more complicated!

I do have his marriage certificate, he married a Margaret Watkin on 5 November 1887 in Newtown.  His father is named as Thomas Astley a labourer.  The only Thomas Astley's around when he was born was his mother Margarets Uncle and her cousin, Thomas [her Uncle Thomas's son]. I can't see it being Margaret's cousins son as he married Ann Jones in 1867 and has a son in 1873/74 whom he calls Thomas.  So if he already had a son called Thomas i can't see him calling another one Thomas.  Also I don't really want to think of it being her Uncle's son because that's a bit weird.

Maybe he just put Thomas Astley down to look respectable as he was illegitimate.  As no father is down on his birth certificate. Yet he married a woman who had had an illegitimate child two years previously and Martin Watkin became his stepson so why he needed to lok=ok respectable I don't know.
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: Lloydy on Friday 16 February 07 18:58 GMT (UK)
Oh my goodness astley, it does get complicated doesn't it?!!!!!! :o

I have to admit that I don't know what else to suggest at this point.   I looked at the 1891 census to see if there was a Thomas Astley born around 1835 (ish) but there isn't any.

I agree with you that I don't think he would be Margaret's Uncle's son - that would be very odd, and as for wanting to look respectable as he was illegitimate, well I think that was very common. 

I need to have another think :-\ ;D

Jan



Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: GROBE on Saturday 03 March 07 20:40 GMT (UK)
interested to hear that your decendent was born in Bronhaul in Llanwnog - I now live in Bronhaul Llanwnog - do you have any information / pictures on the property?
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: KiwiMusic on Wednesday 14 March 07 03:23 GMT (UK)
Hello,

I found your thread about Margaret Astley, daughter of Evan and Martha. I am interested in any information you may have about the Astley family as I am a descendant of Evan's brother, Richard. I have very little information about this side of the family as my great-grandmother Astley died when my grandmother was about three.

If you are interested in making contact I would be delighted to hear from you.

Sara
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: heddwch on Wednesday 25 June 08 09:37 BST (UK)
Hello. I have been researching the Aslteys from Llanwynog. I wondered if there was a connection:-
David Asltey (hasley) ironstone miner born llanwynog Montgomeryshire aged 36
Jane Edwards born Montgomeryshire aged 34
Children John 15 born as above coal miner
David 11 coal miner
Elizabeth 8 born Dowlais
Ann 2 born Dowlais
Edward 5 months born Dowlais
from the 1851 census

Edward is my great grandfather.
Regards heddwch
 
Title: Re: Margaret Astley born 1838 in Llanwnog
Post by: heddwch on Wednesday 25 June 08 09:42 BST (UK)
Sorry have spelt Astley incorrectly? whoops Heddwch