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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Devon => Topic started by: Sueh2 on Tuesday 30 January 07 09:33 GMT (UK)
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Hi,
I have the marriage cert for my relative Charles Harvey who was in the Royal Navy. He was born in Driffield, Yorks and joined up in Devonport at the age of 15.
It states that he married EMILY JANE COLVILL, 24 a spinster whose father was John Colvill ( deceased ) a farmer.
They were married at the Weslyan Chapel on Morice St, Devonport in 1899.
The witnesses were not relations
So why can I find no trace of Emily Jane before or after her marriage? what I have discovered is that COLVILL is not a common name in Devon but that COLWILL is. I have tried all sorts of variations of spelling for Colvill but still nothing. Of course she could have come from further afield.
Can someone suggest what I can do next, suggestions as to why I can't find her welcome. I have spent hours searching to no avail.
HELP!!!!!
Sue
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If she was 24 then she should be on both 1891 and 81 census. Have you tried a search for all Emilys born c1875 plus or minus a bit with father John? A long job but it might work. Similarly long is births - all free to search on ancestry. She must be there somewhere!
I suppose they might be abroad in 1901. Have you looked for Charles' naval record? What children did they have? Tracing them might show where they were living. Have you got their death certificates?
You have probably done all this - just trying to think of other things!
Andrea
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How old was Charles? Just ocurred to me that if he was younger she might have "altered" her age a bit! It would also help to find him in 1901. How do you know the marriage witnesses were not relatives? Who were they?
She is not leaping out at me at the moment I'm afraid. Found Charles at sea in 1901 so that is not helpful!
Andrea
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Hi Andrea,
I've searched births on FreeBMD and followed up throught the census returns on one or two, but have discounted them.
I have Charles' naval record but although it gives the names of his ships it is not that simple to find out where the ships were. Much of his time was spent in Devonport. In 1901 after his marriage he is in Hong Kong but where was his wife Emily? Could she be with him? If so how can I find out?
I don't know if there were any children, Harvey is fairly common in Devon. I think that I might look for their deaths, could be a long job.
I keep thinking that she must be there somewhere but where!!
Thanks for the suggestions,
Sue
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Hi Andrea,
Charles was older than Emily, 26 at the time of his marriage. One witness is another RN chap who I am guessing was a friend of Charles, the other an unmarried girl who I am guessing was a friend of Emily but I could be wrong of course.
I have searched the address which Emily gives on her marriage cert but it has not thrown up anything useful, I looked at 1891 and 1901.
Sue
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It is most unlikely she was with him in 1901 but easy enough to check by looking at all the other entries on that particular ship on the census. He was on the ocean not in port unfortunately. No idea if Hong Kong had a census then. What about their children? Do you know where they were born?
FreeBMD is not full coverage so you do really need to look at the complete entries for births.
What about baptism? Have you searched the register for the church where she married to see if she was baptised there, or that her parents married there?
Andrea
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Have just looked at the witnesses again.
One is E Parkhouse so no idea of gender, there are several candidates one is an Emmanuel Parkhouse who is also R Navy. His wife Emma is living at 56 Chapel St in 1891, my Emily Jane gives her address in 1899 as 34 Chapel St, so either of them would fit.
The other Daniel Cotter is also R Navy, well in 1891 there is a 16 year old Daniel Cotter in the RN in Devonport. His age would make him contemporary with my Charles.
So just educated guesses as to whether I have the correct people.
Charles was definitely still in Devonport in 1919 but I am working on him from a sideways point of view ( gt grandfather's brother) I have nothing to go on from more recent times. I am especially interested as I now live in Cornwall and wonder if there may be long lost rellies in the nearby Plymouth area. The rest of the family are still in Yorkshire.
Sue
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Hi,
Can you tell me any more about Charles Harvey? Who was his father? My partner's 3 x great grandfather, William Harvey, was born in Devonport but moved to Lincolnshire in the mid 1800s. He was in the Coastguard Service and lived around Glanford Brigg/Killingholme areas.
I wondered whether this could be the same family as yours, Driffield being not all that far away from North Lincolnshire and it could account for why your Charles went all that way, from Yorkshire to Devonport, in order to join the navy.
Just a thought.
Jen
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1891 CENSUS
RG12/1337; 10; 14
Ellen J Colvill (15) is living with the Harvey family at 38 Clova Rd, West Ham.
No sign of Charles... away at sea? ...Or just a coincidence?
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In the 1881 Census there is a son, Algernon C. Harvey aged 10 - Who could blame him for dropping the 'Algernon' :o, I'll bet his middle name was Charles ! :D
feralcat
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Feralcat
Are you saying that this should be Emily? There does not seem any connection with Yorkshire for the Harvey family so I would be a bit wary.
Andrea
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Hi Andrea,
I'm saying no such thing! I'm just putting forward possibilities in the absence of any others!
Who in their right mind would join the RN with a name like Algernon C. Harvey?
In this genealogy game i've found that it's unwise to dismiss anything as out of hand. ::) Best to keep it in your 'shoebox' - just in case!
Cheers, feralcat :)
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Hi Feralcat
Now that you have edited your post to add more I can see your reasoning but I believe that Sueh2 has earlier census records for Charles in Yorkshire - at least that is how I read her post.
Andrea
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Hi Andrea,
Please don't think I was being sneaky by amending my post, you had'nt posted at the time I did it! ...honest! ::)
Y'know I've got a bloke in my 'tree' who was born in THREE different places. Perhaps he suffered from amnesia or something! ;D
Cheers for now and good hunting.
feralcat
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Hi,
Thanks for that info Feralcat but Charles is definitely from Driffield in Yorkshire, however Ellen J Colvill might be worth following since I am grasping at straws with this one. I have had marriage certs with errors on so you just never know.
On with the search!! Thanks for your interest.
Sue
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Cheers Sue, Good Luck!
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Have you looked at the Chapel records for the marriage to see if they are the same?
Andrea
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Hi,
Thanks Andrea that seems a sensible thing to do, just have to find out where I can do that and put it on the "to do list"
Sue