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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Lincolnshire => England => Lincolnshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Ruskie on Friday 19 January 07 12:51 GMT (UK)
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As Findmypast (which I have credits for) inconveniently does not have the 1851 census, can someone please do a lookup on Ancestry for me?
I've got a messy note here that I wrote ages ago with the following information:
1851 census
ROBINSON Thomas age 75 Innkeeper and farmer born Helpringham
Elizabeth 67 wife
Ann 33 unmarr dau
Martha ? unmarr dau
plus a servant
Sorry I neglected to take any other details as I didn't think they were relevant - wrong!
I am particulary interested in the address and places of birth.
Thanks a lot.
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1851 census
HO107/2101/285
Willoughby de Broke Arms Inn, Helpringham
ROBINSON Thomas age 75 Innkeeper and farmer 23 acres born Helpringham
Elizabeth 67 wife Morton
Ann 33 unmarr dau Helpringham
Martha 33 unmarr dau Helpringham
John WADDINGHAM 16 Ostler, Helpringham
According to the IGI, Martha should have been 30.
I thought the pub name must be wrong but ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baron_Willoughby_de_Broke
You might find this page handy-
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~heckington/Nearby_Villages/Great_Hale/Heydour/Holland_Fen/Horbling/helpringham.html
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Wonderful Geoff, thank you very much.
My theory seems to be right. In the 1861 census I believe that Thomas's son Thomas and his family have taken over the running of the same Inn. Thomas snr most likely dead by 1861.
Many thanks for the links too. Some interesting reading there.
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Burials at Helpringham
Thomas ROBINSON 29 Oct 1859 (84)
Elizabeth ROBINSON 8 Aug 1860 (77)
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Thanks very much for those burials - it's all fitting together nicely.
Do you have any thoughts as to where these two burials may have taken place? Isn't St Andrew the church in Helpringham - may they be in the churchyard there perhaps?
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Isn't St Andrew the church in Helpringham - may they be in the churchyard there perhaps?
Yes, that's where they were buried.
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Thanks again Geoff.
By the way, I've just had a good look at those links you gave me. The second one (rootsweb) is particularly useful. I've found several familiar Robinson's in the directories!
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Still going ... finding lots of Robinson bmd's now. I'm very grateful for the link. Loads of info! Thanks again!
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Hi Geoff,
I have got a huge amount of information from the rootsweb link - do they have similar for other towns?
I'm a bit thick when it comes to these things - could you possibly provide a link to enable me to search other towns/villages?
I did have look at rootsweb in general, but got lost and couldn't find anywhere to search for other places (Colsterworth for starters).
Your help is much appreciated.
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It would be nice if a page like that would simply "appear" for every village but, sadly, live isn't like that, is it?
However you may find Genuki useful-
http://www.genuki.org.uk:8080/big/eng/LIN/parishes.html
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Yes, should have known it was too good to be true. Thanks for the genuki link. You never know what you'll find.
I've progressed SO much today, both with the link you provided and rootsweb in general. I've visited rootsweb many times, but never found much of relevance to me, but today I discovered a possible connection with someone who has taken their tree back to the 1600's. You do hear these stories sometimes, but never think it will happen to you. I think it just has. (It's my partner's family though, not mine!)
And all thanks to you. I'm very grateful!
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Hi :) just joined this forum and was searching through previous posts on the surnames and places in my family tree and was glad to have seen your post. As far as I can see Thomas Robinson, Inn Keeper at Helpringham was my Great, Great, Great Grandfather!
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Hello wwheel, and welcome to Rootschat! :)
It's been a long long time since I did any research on the Robinsons, so I will need to have a look through my old files as I am very rusty. But the good news is that I am a lot better at family history research than when I posted that question. (Well at least I hope I am. ;))
My partner is descended from this line:
Thomas Robinson b1775 married Elizabeth Mitchinson.
Their son William Robinson b1809 in Helpringham married Elizabeth Creasey.
Their daughter Ellen Robinson was b1847 in Colsterworth.
Ellen was a schoolmistress and married Robert Frost, a schoolmaster, in 1869.
Thomas Robinson b 1775 is also his gr gr gr grandfather. :)
Which of Thomas's children are you descended from?
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Really good to stumble upon Robinson family members on here, thank you both for sharing the connection :)
OK, here goes, if it's the same Thomas Robinson at Helpringham, could be my Great x 4 Grandfather (I missed 1 x great from the first count!)
Thomas Robinson b 1776 Helpringham, Innkeeper,
-son John Robinson b 1813, married Rebecca Day in 1847 at Sleaford
- daughter Fanny Robinson b 1848 married William Goodliffe in 1873
- daughter Rebecca Ann Goodliffe b 1876, East Retford, my great grandmother.
More recently when I can have been trying to sift through records on lincstothepast.org, to look for details about Rebecca Day's family, still searching for a baptism record. On one of the censuses Rebecca Day's birth place is described as Boston (looked no record of Baptism), then Wildmore Fen or Bolingbroke in Lincolnshire. Will keep searching, and will be back on this wonderful forum. :)
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Hi again. I have your John Robinson on my tree - he was bapt 25th April 1812. I have 11 children for Thomas and Elizabeth, so 10 siblings for your John. :o
I will get back to you later with some more info, but have to go out now. :)
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wwheel,
I've been thinking about your Rebecca Day. Do you have her marriage certificate? At least this should give her father's name and also confirm that you are tracing the correct John Robinson.
I did find a possible Rebecca Day in the 1841 census living in New Sleaford - unfortunately she is a Servant so not at home with her own family. She is aged 25. HO107/622/14/21. Do you know if this is the correct Rebecca?
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There are several John Robinsons with wife Rebecca in Lincolnshire in the 1851 census. I think I found the one you are referring to with daughter Fanny, however Fanny is transcribed as being 13 (so born 1838 rather than 1848, so I'm not sure how this fits in with their marriage in 1847?). The image isn't too clear and may be 3. Son John appears to be 1. Are you sure you have the correct John and Rebecca? There are a couple of possible earlier marriages on Freebmd. :-\
Do you have Fanny's birth certificate?
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Hi Ruskie,
After searching through papers, I have the marriage certificate for John Robinson, Farmer, Helpringham and Rebecca Day, 19th May 1847, although her father's name and profession has a black line of ink in, it doesn't say her father was deceased. Residence is listed as New Sleaford.
Census
1841, Rebecca Day, resident, New Sleaford, birthplace Lincolnshire
Married 1847
1851, Rebecca Robinson resident, Helpringham, birthplace Boston, Lincs
1871, Rebecca Robinson, resident Surfleet, birthplace Boston, Lincs
1881, Rebecca Robinson, resident, Surfleet, birthplace, Wildmore Fen, Lincolnshire
1891, Rebecca Robinson, resident, East Retford, birthplace, Boston
The 1881 census helped with the name Wildmore Fen, can only hope this is the place. After looking online about the history of the area of Wildmore Fen, it was a newly drained fen creating new village(s), it looks as if a church was set up in 1816, the year of Rebecca's birth 1814. Although I am slightly clucthing at straws, have found the lincstothepast.com website really helpful, although still no sign of Rebecca Day, although still unsure if I am heading in the right direction. Will keep on searching :-)
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Just found another piece of the puzzle, I contacted Sleaford library they were really helpful, and helped me to decipher the road name on the 1841 census for Rebecca Day, it was Southgate the main High Street in Sleaford. According the 1842 Whites Directory the address belonged to John Marston, a Brewer in Sleaford.
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Well that is the same Rebecca Day I found in the 1841, an FS, living in New Sleaford at Southgate.
I am wondering if she was illegitimate if there was no father named on her marriage certificate? That may mean the end of the line, IF you can find a baptism.
I see you are missing the 1861 census? I will see if I can find it, and I will also check the censuses you've listed, and the different places of birth for Rebecca (to see their proximity to eachother).
Do you have Fanny's birth certificate? Is this her?:
Births Mar 1848
ROBINSON Fanny Sleaford 14 535
Robinson Fanny Sleaford 14 538
(two entries in Freebmd - maybe due to two births or being unsure of last digit? :-\)
There are quite a few Fanny Robinson births ....
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Do you have Fanny's birth certificate? Is this her?:
Births Mar 1848
ROBINSON Fanny Sleaford 14 535
Robinson Fanny Sleaford 14 538
You will see on FreeBMD that the first entry has Sleaford in italics. This is because the number (535) does not fall within the range of the pages covering Sleaford in that quarter. Click on (http://www.freebmd.org.uk/btnInfo.gif) you'll see that is 537-558.
If you click on the (http://www.freebmd.org.uk/scanavail.gif) to the right of the entry, you will see the GRO index page ... this (fairly) clearly shows the page number is 538. :)
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Thanks for the explanation Geoff - I checked the first entry after I posted (and thought it was 535 :P), but was unable to see the second one for some reason.
wwheel,
On their marriage certificate who is John's father and what is his occupation?
I have just checked all the censuses for John and Rebecca and agree that it is the same family. I also think that on the 1851 census Fanny's age should be 3 - this ties in with her age in other censuses. THey have a son John H aged 1 in the 1851 census but in the other censuses they have a son Charles b 1852. Maybe John died?
I have found the family in 1861 - let me know if you would like the details.
I still haven't checked the locations of the various birth places of Rebecca. It could be that she just said she was born in Boston on most of the censuses as it was the nearest large town. You may need to look at the other places for her birth, or any small villages in the general area? :-\ I also wonder, if she was illegitimate, that she may have been registered with her mother's maiden name?
As John and Rebecca were living with daur Fanny and family in East REtford in Notts in 1891, I wonder if these might be their deaths?:
Death Jun1/4 1894
Rebecca Robinson
E. Retford
7b 7
Deaths Dec1/4 1899
John Robinson
age 87
E.Retford
7b 8
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Hello
Dont know if you are all still here as this thread was 3 years ago but I too am descended from Thomas Robinson 1775 through his son Thomas 1822 his son Edward 1858 his daughter Edith born 1887. Edward was a Grocer/Draper in Helpringham and left for Derbyshire between 1891 and 1901. I cant find his death or any of the family on the 1911 census except eldest daughter Edith who had returned to Warwickshire where Edwards wife had come from. I guess Edward died before 1911 and his wife and children returned to Warwickshire. I think the wife died 1921 in Warwickshire. Anyway be good to hear from any of you long lost cousins! :)
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Hello bsidebaby. Welcome to rootschat. :)
I actually started this thread in 2007, so it's 8 years old (the last post was three years ago), but I'm still here.
I haven't looked at this line since 2012 so had to have a quick look at my tree to refresh my memory. It seems that you and my husband must be distant cousins.
I'll have a look to see if I can spot any of your missing Robinsons. If I, or anyone else who is following this thread, can't find them, it might be worth starting a new thread of your own which might reach a wider audience of potential helpers. :)
I might be back later with some questions for you ...
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Hi again bsidebaby. A few questions:
Who did Thomas 1822 marry and when (so I can add this to my tree ;))
Their son Edward b 1858 - who did he marry and when?
And Edith - you say you have her in 1911 in Warwickshire - was she married at that time? If not when and who did she marry?
Can you give me names and birth years and places of Edith's siblings please?
It might make the search easier if I have names and details of a few more family members. :)
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I managed to find the family on the 1901 census so have the children's names, but like you I can't find any of them in 1911.
It is possible that some of the children married but you would expect to be able to find the boys and young Evelyn b 1900. I had a reasonable forage around but could not find any of them (nor Edith) using variations of search terms and surname.
Generally when a whole family is missing they have been mistranscribed or they may have emigrated. It would be unusual for them all to have died between 1901 and 1911.
I couldn't see them on the Ellis Island index. I didn't check Australia. ::) It might also be worth checking Canada as one of their 'cousins' ended up there.
Hopefully someone who is a better searcher than me will be able to find them for you. :-\
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Hi Ruskie
Thanks for your replies. Like an idiot I completely forgot that I did find the 1911 census for them the other week. They are all living in Rugby Warwickshire and Edward has died so he must have died between 1901 and 1911. Edith married John Thomas Gilbert and had her first son John Edward Gilbert both in 1910.
Thomas Robinson 1822 married Elizabeth Lyon in 1847 in Colsterworth Lincs.
Edward Robinson 1858 married Elizabeth Roberts in 1887 Stretton on Fosse Warwickshire.
Thanks for getting in touch! :)
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Good to hear from you and thanks for the extra information.
I'm glad you managed to find the family in 1911. I'll see if I can track them down now that I know they are there somewhere. :)
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I received a PM from wwheel and as it contains information that may help future researchers, I will post it here:
Hi Ruskie, just looked the message board and read the new posts about the Robinson family from Helpringham, it always good to read fresh info on the Robinson family. Only guessing that the John Robinson in my tree could be the son of Thomas Robinson, publican, from Helpringham.
As far as I can see in my varying notes, Rebecca Day married John Robinson in Sleaford on 13th May 1847, on the marriage certificate John was a farmer, residence at the time of the marriage was Helpringham, father Thomas Robinson, publican. There is a birth certificate for Fanny Robinson, daughter of John and Rebecca, born 16th March 1848, in the district of Aswarby. Another birth certificate for Charles Robinson, born 1852 registered in the sub district of Gosberton, from the notes looks like he was known as Chas, and possibly lived in Retford also. John and Rebecca's daughter Fanny married William Goodliff (of Horbling, Lincs), and resided in the Half Moon public house in Retford, Nottinghamshire. John Robinson (m.1847) would have been my g-g-g-g-grandfather if that is of any help. Tried over years to try and find out more about Rebecca Day, as far as I could see from the censuses, she may have been born in Bolingbroke Fen/allotment, a newly drained and created fen when she was born in approx 1802, some of the censuses say she was born in Boston, Lincs, have searched baptism records with no luck, will keep on searching.