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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: kerryb on Thursday 23 November 06 10:00 GMT (UK)
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I was wondering what people do with census returns after they have downloaded them.
I keep downloading them to find out family members and where ancestors were born and lived etc but then they just get stored in files under the ancestor surname.
However recently I have had reason to go back to a couple and found I have missed things like a 4 x gr grandfather married again and in another a child has popped up that I had not noticed before.
So does anyone keep records other than the download of census returns? Do you do anything else with the information, like write it down or put it in a database for instance?
Kerry
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It all goes into my FTM and periodically migrates up to Tribal Pages.
See no point in keeping all images on the PC - they are safe with Ancestry or whomever !
I've tided a few up with cropping and enhancing and framing for pressies tho ...
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I find that using a computer programme does help in this way - I use Family Historian - and can enter the details for each census again each person listed. If I find an unknown grandchild I can add the person to the tree so that the information is listed again him/her and can also add this person to a Named List and so flagged up to remind me to follow up on other details about them.
Mary
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Hmm
Perhaps I need to update my family tree software, it doesn't allow me to enter census details anywhere. I presume both of you are talking about software with a specific census bit??
Kerry
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Hi Kerry,
I printed all of mine off...& they are all in a box-file somewhere upstairs!!!
I keep meaning to organize them though...
Romilly. ;)
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Hi Kerry
I keep the images on my computer - one day I will stop subscribing to web sites so like to have my own copy. I also transcribe them (with reference) - I simply put the full transcription into the notes section of my Family Tree program - against the head of the household. Sometimes I will duplicate it against others in the family - depending on how important they are to me.
I seem to write lots of small stories about different branches of my families and the transcription is usually part of these as well.
No doubt one day, someone will delete all my files - presumably by then it will not be of concern to me.
Trish
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I agree Trish, it is all well and good leaving the census returns on Ancestry or wherever but like you what I cancel my subscription. At least because I have downloaded them all, I have them until someone deletes them off my computer and chucks away all my CDs.
My problem is just knowing what to do with the information on them so that I don't miss things. I shall have to relook at my family tree software to see if I could put it in somehow.
Kerry :) :)
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Hi Kerry ..
it is all well and good leaving the census returns on Ancestry or wherever but like you what I cancel my subscription.
Hey - do whats right for you !
My personal view is that the bulk of my family records in the form of census returns, albeit original and interesting - arent critical to my Tree once analysed and transcribed.
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Perhaps I need to update my family tree software, it doesn't allow me to enter census details anywhere
I put them in the notes section.
I also put them in an Excel form that I have created with column headers.
Because my ancestors lived in a tiny hamlet, I include all the individuals in that hamlet not just my ancestors in my Excel database.
downside
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Yes Family Historian and many other programmes would have somewhere that you can enter census details and attach them to all the people they are applicable to.
I do like to keep the original images just for my own use as I've sometimes looked back to them and discovered a related family with a different name living nearby.
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Calm Newfy :) :) ;) ;)
I have actually found going back some time after to census returns that what I thought was an unconnected family turns out to be a child with new husband for example. So if I should ever run out of money and not be able to afford Ancestry any more, I wouldn't have to totally start again.
Downside - Excel sheet sounds a good idea, I recently set one up for all certificates that I might like to buy/find useful etc so that when I have a bit of spare cash, I pick the one that might be of most use to buy!
Kerry
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I grappled with this for ages. Took advice off various boards, still not sure what is best. In FTM I attach them as a source and then put the different facts as FACT for each person. I am really interested in the addresses they had, and how you can often find other rellies or people they married as neighbours.
There was a discussion called "How and where to enter census data etc" on the Ancestry genealogy software/family tree maker message board started on 22 April 2006, which has some fantastically detailed suggestions on how to do things. It is still there, you do not have to be a member. Just go to Ancestry.co.uk, click on the header "Ancestry Community", then click "other topics" then "see more topics" then you see a list of all the message board titles. on the FTM board keep clicking next to get to the thread.
I do think if this is to be PROPER research, everything you find should be documented. If one of your descendants wants to carry on your work they need to know how you got to your tree.
I also print out the census images and file them (actually mostly in a plastic box at present, but good intentions....).
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I use Family Historian - and can enter the details for each census again each person listed.
MaryA, is Family Historian worth persevering with?
It was bought for a present and I had it very briefly on my old computer, but didn't bother too much. Wondering whether it is worth giving it another try?
Pels
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Kerry - dont misunderstand, I'm just saying that whatever solution is good for you - is good for you :)
merely stating my own view ...... :D
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That's ok Newfy you didn't use a smiley!!! :) :)
I like to think by downloading census returns from Ancestry I am getting my money's worth from them!! ::) ::)
Kerry
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Pels, Re Family Historian, I haven't found it difficult at all, still have the old version, updated with many free updates, although there is a new Upgrade.
I find it very useful as I can store everything I have, including attaching images of wills, censuses etc. so that I know where everything is kept and just on looking at a report for any particular person I know at a glance just what I've got, and also (probably more importantly) what I'm probably missing.
There are a lot of add-ons also, such as Gedcom Census, which is an easy way of entering the census details, attaching the image if you want to, and having the details appear for each individual.
There is a good website with an searchable archive which gives great explanations and also a User Group who between them seem to answer any queries, thrown at them.
The new version does have the facility to create a website, although I don't see it as a failing in the older version that I have since I wasn't intending to use it for that originally. There's probably a lot that I haven't yet investigated but just to use the basic functions helps me to keep all my bits together.
Hope it helps you
Mary
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MaryA - Thankyou!
Must admit I did originally install it when my old computer was playing up - not enough memory etc.
I felt a bit guilty about not giving it a second chance but then to be honest it did seem complicated.
By this you may have gathered I am also one of those people who keeps everything in a file and drawn up on A4 sheets of paper!
This has now given me a project - hopefully I'm a bit more computer literate than I was when it was given to me!
Many thanks once again,
Pels :)
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I'm going to have and go and investigate some other family tree packages. Mine seems very basic compared to some of the others.
Kerry
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I keep mine with Ancestry but the even safer way is to print them off and give them to my Mum :D
My Mum then files them, brings them out periodically (when there's nothing on the TV) studies them and comes up with some brilliant ideas. I do the same with my Certs, I scan them and Mum keeps the originals.
If I pop round unannounced I often find her sat at the dining table, glasses perched on the end of her nose and all the info spread out :-* :-* :-* :D
Mum's great for pointing out the obvious that I didn't see :)
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I keep mine with Ancestry but the even safer way is to print them off and give them to my Mum :D
My Mum then files them, brings them out periodically (when there's nothing on the TV) studies them and comes up with some brilliant ideas. I do the same with my Certs, I scan them and Mum keeps the originals.
If I pop round unannounced I often find her sat at the dining table, glasses perched on the end of her nose and all the info spread out :-* :-* :-* :D
Mum's great for pointing out the obvious that I didn't see :)
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I'm going to have and go and investigate some other family tree packages. Mine seems very basic compared to some of the others.
Kerry
I recently got Family Historian (latest version) but I have a backlog of updating to do from the data transferred from my old programme (Great Family). Bit I'd endorse what MaryAa has said. In particular, the gedcom census add-on is excellent because you can attach the actual census images. Bit it takes time!
On Great Family I had transcribed census data into the "notes" box. But Family Historian allows for greater integration of the data.
As if you hadn't guessed, I generally download and save the census images (how much longer will I want to maintain an ancestry subscription?). I also keep hardcopies in binders with associated material - binders for a branch of the family (at great grandparent level), subdivided into generations, with papers for each person in a plastic folder.
Anally retentive, or what?
JULIAN
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Hi Julian
I'm seriously considering Family Historian. I know Gadget uses it and recommends it ;D It seems to do a lot of what I want to be able to do with such resources as my census returns.
I don't keep paper copies of them yet but as I have just put all of my certificates into nice files in order copies of census records may follow!
Anally retentive - NO, just organised!!!!!! ;) ;)
Kerry
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Hi Julian
I'm seriously considering Family Historian. I know Gadget uses it and recommends it ;D It seems to do a lot of what I want to be able to do with such resources as my census returns.
I don't keep paper copies of them yet but as I have just put all of my certificates into nice files in order copies of census records may follow!
Anally retentive - NO, just organised!!!!!! ;) ;)
Kerry
I love Family Historian and would recommend it too. I also use Gedcom Census (which is a free download) to enter the details of census returns, but I love just reading the returns anyway, not just the bit of them that relates to my family. I download furiously whenever I can afford an Ancestry sub, and then read and enjoy at my leisure.
Veron
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Thanks Veron, I think I'm going to treat myself to an early Christmas present! Either that or perhaps the other half to buy it for me. But then can I wait another month to play with it!!!!
Kerry :) :)
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I file the images in the same way you do Kerry, and use the census reference in my source data. However, I find it very frustrating that I can't add an image of the census into my database and then attach all the people featured on that page by their role.
I always have to go back to the image and like other posters have later found valuable information that was missed first time around.
For the opportunity to shape a future software package, have a look here:
http://familysearchlabs.org/em/Main.html
At least we can start to ask for what we want....
Jean
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Hi there,
I'm lucky in that I can log Census records in my family tree software. However, I keep copies of all downloads (census and Scottish BMDs) on my Mac and keep printed filed copies. I find that if I go through all my printouts a couple of times a year, I find several pieces of new information that I had missed first (or maybe even second and third) time around. I don't think I would do this if I only kept them on the computer or never kept the images at all.
Retaining all the images also gives my husband another reason to think that I am barking mad!!!
Cheers,
Clare
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I've tided a few up with cropping and enhancing and framing for pressies tho ...
What a brilliant idea newfy - that's my sister-in-law sorted for Christmas!
Ellen
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Oh dear! It's all too technical for me.
Being old fashioned and still reluctant to commit my precious findings to the mercies of the computer, I print everything off. At least I have it to hand if I need to refer to something quickly. I've also got it back up in a box file and notebook.
There is only one problem, as the mountain grows daily I shall soon need climbing gear!!!!!!!
I'll just repeat what some of the others have said. Try different ways and go with what suits your way of working. What is right for you may be wrong for someone else.
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Absolutely Tuscany and I think I would probably print everything off too if I didn't have a big sticker on my computer telling me not to print unless absolutely necessary to save trees!
A colleague at work produced a poster and it is worded in the way she talks and I wouldn't dare, believe me!!!!!! :-\ :-\ :-\ :o :o :o
kerry
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Kerryb -
I make copies, at least two, and keep them in different places. I have a complete set of downloaded census data with each of my family surnames either in manila envelopes or in three ring binders inside file cabinnets.
I also have one set I carry with me whenever I go out on genealogical research trips. That way I can write on them, and if I happen to misplace (lose) I have another set with my permanent research.
Sounds complicated but I can't yet bring myself to fully depend on a computer.
(See below).
May seem like I am insensitive to the environment but I have tried many systems and this appears to work best for me.
I would love to put all my information on a computer but I had my identity "borrowed / stolen" almost five years ago while using a computer and I'm still having problems to this day. Another story for another day...
Bottom line is to use whatever works best for you.
yn9man
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Blimey ! I dont even have a Printer on this PC ......
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Because I was doing all this long before the Internet became popular and had to use the films, and also because, having worked with computers for years I don't trust them :-[ I transcribe everything I find onto paper, then copy it into a database in MS Access. If the information relates to a known family member I add the relevant items to my tree in FTM; I also add it to the associated chapter in the relevant family book in MS Word.
Every so often I back up the files; I also print out the reports from the database and the books from Word. If you are still following, you will have worked out that I now have 4 copies of the information! I take the relevant printouts with me when visiting the archives - it easier than lugging my laptop nd I can write on the back of the sheets.
It works for me - you have to be able to write your own database application though, so not for the faint hearted!
Regards, Bill
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I also print all mine up. I have a ring binder file for each family and have the census from 1841 to 1901 filed in between BMD certs and photographs etc. So each family is documented from birth to death.
Cost a lot of money in ink, my printer/scanner/copier being a Hewlett Packard, and the casettes being sealed so you can't refill them. But it's my main hobby, and it's lovely to be able to pick up a ring binder and read the family history from beginning to end.
Su
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Su
I understand what you mean, since I filed all my BMD's a few weeks ago I keep picking up the files and just looking through them and it is amazing what bits of information I have picked up on that was previously missed.
Which the reason why I have been toying with printing out the census returns, because when I look at them I see things I have missed before.
And yes it is nice to have something physically to show for the main hobby!!! ;D ;D ;D
Newfy - would you like us to start a printer collection for you :o :o :o ;)
Kerry
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Very kind :D
Altho I havent had to use one for 4 years now - if I want anything printed with top quality I email it to a contact with an amazing laser-printer wiv all bells and whistles.
I guess 30 years in the industry got me used to 'the paperless office' - I can find anything very quickly .....
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Arrr yes the paperless office!!! I've been trying to introduce that concept at work (in the environmental sector!) with very little success. Being an administrator, at college nearly 20 years it was thought that the paperless office was going to put us administrators out of business.
I'm still here!!!! ::) ::) ::) ::)
Kerry
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kerryb -
I find looking at a "hard copy" document easier than looking at a computer screen. Does this show my age?
Also, I enjoy looking back through my research papers. Every now and then I will notice something I hadn't seen previously or look at in a different light. I also find paper an easier method to use when sharing information.
Having several documents in front of me at one time helps me to focus on what surname or family member I am researching.
yn9man
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I type mine into the notes section on my FTL software and also have it backed up on CD. This prints out onto Family Group sheets.
No need to keep hard copies for me :)
Dolly
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I do like looking at copies of the originals so that I can see who the neighbours were and what they did. It gives an idea of the sort of locality.
I have also found several relatives living close by through looking at the documents.
Ellen
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I've now ordered a copy of Family Historian and I am going to work through all the census returns and add them to it.
Job for the new year!!!!!!
Kerry
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Elliebob -
What a great idea to see what sort of locality or area they lived in. I will attempt to do the same. :) That sort of "tip"or "idea'" is what makes this site so great.
I also have found some of my English relatives (not my Scottish though) lived near each other on the same street or neighborhood by using census records.
yn9man
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I actually save on cd and print them out. I have found myself going back to old ones as I find other family members and am suprised that to find who I thought was just a neighbor was a parent and older siblings. I forget that extended family all lived together until the early 20th century. Modern families just don't seem to do the same.
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Isn' t it amazing what you can miss first time round on a census return. I guess because we are so focussed on finding whatever it is we are looking for we miss the other bits of useful information!!!!
Or that's what I find anyway! ::) ::) ::)
Kerry
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kerryb -
In that same neighborhood as you.
I try to be more careful in my review of documents now but I still have the knack of missing things. :) :)
I have gone back on a few occasions now to find neighbors eventually turned to relatives (sons and daughters getting married etc.).
yn9man
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I seem not only to have missed neighbours but children and grandchildren ??? ???
The ones that I wasn't expecting to be there I have kind of ignored! :D :D
Kerry
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That's one advantage of working the "old-fashioned" way from the films - you scan every page looking for family names and often pick up things that you would otherwise miss. I extract every instance of my main family names from all sources, then try to fit them together with their parents by comparing information.
I have ended up with a number of, sometimes quite substantial, family trees that don't immediately fit with mine, but I keep having another look to see if new information can provide that vital link.
Regards, Bill
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Bill
I've got some of those too, census returns for families in vicinity with same name that as yet don't fit but I'm sure they will. I need to sort those too because maybe by now they will fit!!!!!! ::) ::)
Kerry
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Whilst I take the point about conserving trees, at least we are not printing out piles of useless advertising which is binned without even being read.
We are creating a record to pass on to our interested (we hope) decendants. (Of course they may be miffed that we have left them nothing to do).
When our computer records are unusable, because someone has omitted to update them, then down comes the dusty old suitcase and hey presto it's all there. Just think of the fun they'll having trying to decipher our handwritten notes.
At least that's my excuse for printing everything. ::)
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I was reading an article recently in a FH magazine about diaries and the fact that we use abbreviations that people can't understand. Well my FH notes are the same, will they ever be understandable for anyone else!!!
Kerry
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Bill749 -
I find looking at film a bit more difficult. I can only look at film for a short period of time before my eyes go / get blurry. I can look at hard copies it seems like forever.
kerryb -
I think it will probably depend on the abbreviations you use. Many abbreviations can be figured out. If not "anyone else" will have the same "mysteries" to solve that we are attempting to solve today.
yn9man
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I used to be able to do it for hours - now I find myself nodding off after an hour or so! :( I do end up with sore eyes after an afternoon of staring at the screen! :( Must be getting old!!
Bill
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Bill
Can't believe that you are getting old. ;D
The problem is with the technology in the machines ... not conducive to viewing.
yn9man
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I find when I am at the library checking newspapers - if I have the magnification on the film large enough to read it - the adjustments to move the page (at my size it doesn't fit on the screen) often don't work well enough to see the top/bottom and sides of the pages.
When I can view the whole page onscreen I can't read it! I now take a magnifying glass with me
My eyes are definitely older than the rest of me - my mother must have read all the time she was pregnant ::) ::) ::)
Trish
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Trish -
Great line about your Mother. ::) ::) ::)
Next week on my research trip / expedition I will be spending several hours viewing documents. Thanks for reminding me to pack my magnifying glass.
yn9man
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After editing (to remove as much black as possible) and printing off all my hundreds of census images, I've just realised that if I'd saved them as tiff images instead of jpegs, I could have highlighted the entries I'm interested in using Windows Picture and Fax Viewer instead of doing it manually with a highlighter pen. It won't do it with jpegs! :-[
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Spent the afternoon playing with my new Family Historian and Gedcom Census. Does exactly what I wanted to do with my census returns. I've entered 3 and already found someone I didn't know about. :) :)
Got a large number to go but I shall plough on and it will be worth it. What a brilliant package! ;D ;D
Kerry
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kerryb -
Sounds as if your new Family Historian has paid off in immediate dividends. That's great news and truly an early Christmas present. :) :)
I was looking at my census documents last night and found a missing sibling of my g grandfather. Turns our she wasn't really missing .... got married .... to the neighbor.
yn9man
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That's the problem with having so many census returns, I look at them when I download them in terms of the person I was searching for. Then they get stored and not looked at again for ages, so I seem to miss other bits of information, but no more!!!
Kerry
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kerry
Glad to hear you are so happy with family Historian.
Your enthusiasm might / would qualify you as an excellent salesperson for the softwear company.
yn9man
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Sorry I will curb my enthusiasm!
You just wouldn't believe how much I have found out about my family just from adding 29 census returns to it!! ::) ::) ::)
Kerry
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kerryb -
No need to curb your enthusiasm. You NOW have me thinking about getting the family Historian software program. See what a great salesperson you are / could be?
yn9man
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If only they would pay me for being a salesperson!!!!!! I could be rich!!!! :o :o :o :o
Tis a much better package than the one I had which didn't do anything useful. Last night I even was taught how to split my tree. Now that is useful for sending bits to all those contacts out there!!!!
Are you buying yet?? ::) ::) ::)
Kerry :D :D :D ;) ;) ;)
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Splitting your tree?
Assume you are doing in order to get rid of all the relatives you can or just don't want or need anymore. ;) ;) ;)
Not buying yet but on the verge ... or edge .... is probably a better term.
You getting the commission?
yn9man
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It's useful being able to split your tree if you want to send just one surname to a contact rather than the whole lot.
Commission hasn't come through yet!!!! ::) ::) ::)
Kerry :) ;)
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How does that old saying go .... "don't hold your breath waiting". ;) ;)
Or better "the check is in the mail". ::) ::)
yn9man :)
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Never mind
I can always live in hope that someone from the makers will read this ::) ::) ::) ::)
Kerry
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We keep talking it up they most certainly will read ...
Since 'tis the season ... I'll agree, rather reluctantly, that whatever profits you make from Family Historian you can keep all to yourself. :) :)
yn9man