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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: kat2004 on Saturday 16 September 06 17:39 BST (UK)
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Hi, I posted a question on here a long time ago about my gg grandfather so my apologies if this seems familiar :). In 1907 my gg grandfather Thomas William FISHER married my gg grandmother Lucy Barnes in Chester. His occupation on the marriage certificate says Sergeant- The Cheshire Regiment. In 1907 they had my g grandmother, and on her birth certificate Thomas is now working and living at Barrow in Furness (employed at the Shipyard).
So we know he was out of service shortly after 1907, but he must have signed up for WW1 because my g nanna has told me how he died during the war, his body (sadly like too many others) never recovered. His wife remarried in 1922, and is listed as a widower on her 2nd marriage cert.
I've searched the Barrow war memorial and Thomas is not on there (his brother Herbert is - he died at Gallipoli with the Worc reg). I've searched the CWGC and there are four pages of Thomas Fisher's - how do I know which is mine? I've already purchased a few but I'm not sure they are mine (Thomas would have been between 34 and 38y in the duration of the war). I've searched the medal indexes and again there are to many to narrow down. Please would sks help me with this?
I don't think Thomas went back in the Cheshires for WW1 - he could have joned up with his local reg (The Kings Own) or been attached to somewhere else. He may even have died as a result of his injuries post war which would explain why he's not on the local war memorial (if this is the case then I think its appalling that these men arent named also >:()
So I've decided to apply to the Cheshire reg for a search (£10) which may give me his service number, is it worth paying someone to check the records at Kew also? I know 60% were los in a fire so its a long shot, but I really want to do this mans memory justice and find out what happened to him, please couls sks help or advise me?
Thank you :)
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Hi Kat
If you know where the family were living during the time of WW1 then local newspapers are a good option ........... they listed many casualties, often with some family background information. Also, again, if you have an address, it might be worthwhile to check the absent voters list for 1918 just in case he was listed.
There are also the WW1 army death indexes available in the overseas section at the Family Records Centre or online at http://www.1837online.com (pay per view).
Casalguidi
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Hi Kat
He sounds as though he would have been getting on a bit by 1914 but, as he had recently left the service, he would probably still have been on the reserve list, so would have been liable to be recalled in time of war.
However, this could work to your advantage, as his service records are more likely to have survived. If you can get to the archives at Kew, you would be able to look at the original records which would give you enough information to sort out the right one.
Regards, Bill
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kat,be careful about his death,he may not have died as a soldier,he could have been a reservist but rejected for active service cos of his job,hes in a occupation thats important to the war effort,he may have died as a civilian,you say his wife remarried in 1922,given the period of grieving and meeting and remarrying,its likely he died in the early stages of the war,mack
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Thank you all, I think the first step would be to contact the Cheshire Regiment and see what their records hold, meanwhile I will be going to Barrow records office and have a search through the local paper archives and see if if his name crops up there.
I would absolutely love to go to Kew and look up the WW1 records but I live so far away it won't be possible until we can book time away for a holiday, how do I request a Search without being present? Can I call Kew and have a search done by the staff? What are the chances of finding his records without a service number? Should I wait until I hear back from the CHeshire Reg?
Sorry to ask so many questions, last year I did'nt even know I had relatives that died in WW1, I found out just before November 11th about my gg uncle Herbert dying at Gallipoli and was greatly moved to see his name on Barrow cenataph, I'm trying to locate Thomas before this years Remberance day, I really feel like I owe to them both.
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Hi Kat
There are only 2 TW FISHER's on the CWGC site, but both are only 23 years old, so too young to be yours, so it begins to look as though he wasn't killed in WW1.
Regards, Bill
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Thanks Bill, I noticed that but I wondered if they sometimes didn't include middle names on the graves? Nanna always said he died and his body was never found - could this mean he would be in an unnamed grave? Or if he died either abroad or in England post war as a result of his injuries how do I research that? When I searched the Gro army deaths overseas the search came back nil, I've gotta find his service number and take it from there, I'm sure I'll find him somehow!
Thank you all very much :)
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Hi Kat
If there is no known grave - his body was never found or could not be identified - but he was known to have been killed, he would be remembered on one of the memorials such as Thiepval or whichever was the nearest to the place where he died. Many thousands are remembered in this way, but their names will be on the CWGC register.
I would normally expect to find a middle initial, even if his middle name was missed out, although it is possible it might have been missed completely.
I had a look in the London Gazette just in case he got promoted or won a medal but, although the name Thomas Fisher appears several times, the middle name is wrong in every entry.
If he died at home as a result of wounds, his death would be recorded in the normal GRO index. Of course, if he died abroad after leaving the army it would be a different matter. You definitely need to get his army records from Kew. If you are unable to get there in person (its well worth a visit) then maybe some kind soul on this list might volunteer to do a lookup for you next time they are at the archives if you have his details form the Cheshires.
Good luck with your search - I hope you will let us know if you find him.
Regards, Bill
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Thank you Bill, of course I'll let you know - I'm determined to find him :)
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Thank you Bill, of course I'll let you know - I'm determined to find him :)
hiya kat.there were 50 t fishers killed in ww1,i have eliminated 31 of these for various reasons,most are too young to be your gg grandfather,these are whats left
ALL T.FISHERS
21616 MGC arras mem
16904 cheshire regt
17931 welsh regt
17530 royal inniskilling thiepval mem
241908 liverpool regt thiepval mem
26232 duke of wellingtons
513852 london scottish
63559 south lancs
28817 worc regt
20935 RGA
471442 london regt thiepval mem
1786 black watch thiepval mem
332630 liverpool regt
R/201361 KRRC
13763 suffolk regt
A/7612 cameronians ploegsteert mem
7423 worc regt helles mem
10851 east yorks regt helles mem
12300 royal irisf fus helles mem
only nine of these men are missing,the rest have a grave,i have added the details of those who are missing,many soldiers remains have been recovered and ID over the years,thomas,s body could have been recovered since your nan last told you about him being missing,so you cant rule out those with a grave,mack
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you can cross off 513832 london scottish,his wife was mrs j.fisher
mack
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Woah! Thank you for helping me after all this time! I still havent heard from the Cheshires and I'm going to try writing again. I'm going to do some cross referenceing on the above names list (I think I have eliminated some already) and I will get back to you asap. Tahnk you very much for helping me :)
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forget the cheshires kat,the lad in the ches regt 16904 isnt him,he was born and bred in staffs,so you can cross him off your list
AND these as well
17530 royal inniskillins,born+bred belfast
26232 duke of wellingtons born+bred birmingham,formerly berks regt
13763 sukkolk regt,he came from bury st,edmunds+lived there
A/7612 cameronians born+bred,glasgow
10851 east yorks regt he came from hull,
mack
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kat,harribob[on this site] may be able to give you the place of birth of the others,i dont have the roll of honour for those regts,mack
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Thank you Bill, of course I'll let you know - I'm determined to find him :)
hiya kat.there were 50 t fishers killed in ww1,i have eliminated 31 of these for various reasons,most are too young to be your gg grandfather,these are whats left
ALL T.FISHERS
21616 MGC arras mem
16904 cheshire regt
17931 welsh regt
17530 royal inniskilling thiepval mem
241908 liverpool regt thiepval mem
26232 duke of wellingtons
513852 london scottish
63559 south lancs
28817 worc regt
20935 RGA
471442 london regt thiepval mem
1786 black watch thiepval mem
332630 liverpool regt
R/201361 KRRC
13763 suffolk regt
A/7612 cameronians ploegsteert mem
7423 worc regt helles mem
10851 east yorks regt helles mem
12300 royal irisf fus helles mem
only nine of these men are missing,the rest have a grave,i have added the details of those who are missing,many soldiers remains have been recovered and ID over the years,thomas,s body could have been recovered since your nan last told you about him being missing,so you cant rule out those with a grave,mack
kat,non of these men have any connection to the north east.
EXCEPT this lad.
pte 471442 thomas fisher
born,liscard,cheshire
enlisted,barrow in furness
london regt[rangers]
he served under an alias as pte thomas reilley
on the thiepval memorial to the missing
mack
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Fisher 17931 gets a brief mention on my website. He was KIA (died, actually) Xmas Day 1915.
Bernard
http://swanseabattalion.net/