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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Free Photo Restoration & Date Old Photographs => Topic started by: Pippakit on Monday 28 August 06 02:34 BST (UK)
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Can anyone put a rough date to this photo? It was taken in Chester, in the studio of W Speed. Does the uniform give any clues as to the year?
(http://www.bellissiamese.co.uk/ChesterFireman.jpg)
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Gosh thats an old photo Pippa, is that a firemans uniform he is wearing?. The boots make me think so.
Celia
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Yes, I believe it is a fireman's uniform.
This branch of my family came from Chester, so I am assuming that he was in the Chester fire brigade. There was an Earl of Chester's Volunteer Fire Brigade started in the mid 1800s and I wonder if that is what this uniform is.
If I can discover the year, roughly, I might be able to identify which relative is in the picture.
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pippa if you post it in photograph restoration you might get a loverly colour pic that you will get more detail on, give it a try, kali.
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like this but better(http://)
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Hi Pippa,
The Photographic Restoration site is where most people
post queries regarding dates etc. They know what questions etc. to ask. (hopefully)
Tomkin
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Thank you for moving my photo and query to this spot. And thank you for colouring it, doesn't it look different! I never thought the uniform might be blue, doesn't colour bring things to life!
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Hi Pippa,
Sorry, no date, but thought this may help with identification later :-\
Good Luck
Di
PS - My guess would be 1880 - 1885 - but that's a total stab in the dark ;D
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Hi Pippa
Just a quick clean up from me, I will try to colour it tomorrow. Great photo
Lones
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Hello Pippa :)
Do you have the pic, and could you scan the back (if there is anything on it)?
At a guess, with what I can see, i'd say 1870s.
Prue
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Hi Pippa
Just a quick tidy.
Regards
Cazza
;D
Helps if you attach the photo!!! ::)
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This is the back of the photo:
(http://www.bellissiamese.co.uk/BackofFiremanPhoto.jpg)
PS I don't know how to attach a photo, this is my first attempt with pictures and I'm surprised they've worked!!
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W. Speed was trading in 1881 Chester - will try and backtrack him ..
RG11/3555 Folio 111 Page 9 - Chester, 35 Grosvenor St
Boarding with this family ...
John Poynton 62 Head Saddle & Harness Maker Chester
Elizabeth Poynton 59 Wife
Frank Simpson 18 GSon
Mary J. Simpson 13 GDau
William Speed 50 Boarder Photographic Artist born Manchester
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He was Lodging with the same family in Grosvenor St in 1871 ...
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In 1861 he was already in Chester, described as photographic artist - Lodging in Waburghs Mkt ?
So as your pic was shown with the Grosvenor St address, its taken after 1861 I'd guess ...
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Here's another colour version for your collection.
Regards
Cazza
;D
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Oh, wow, a red jacket. I like that one!
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Sorry to but in but you have all missed the other side of his belt or his traousers would fall down. As a fireman myself Im wondering more about the item stored in his belt where one would have expected an axe but it looks lie something else, my guess is some sort of key or wrench for suction hose.
Did Chester ever have a fire dog like other Brigades ie Edinburgh?
Whilst red looks nice I think it would be more accurate if he was earing an all blue firemans tunic and leggings with black fireboots. This type of helmet was black with brass badge and helmet strap and trims.
Gareth
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I thought it was a wrench for the fire hydrant,
I was also going to suggest that if Pippa took a very high resolution scan of just
the helmet badge a lot more information might appear.
Tomkin
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Hi Pippa :)
Thanks for scanning the back.
The photo most probably dates from the early 1870s - is that any help in trying to find out who it is?
Prue
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LOL I thought it looked odd, but I couldn't see the other side of the belt in the original (mind you it was late at night). I thought it was some sort of sash thingy.
Just coloured it for fun (personally I prefer original sepia), Just curious but for some reason I thought fireman's jackets were red in those days, anybody know for sure ???
Cazza
;D
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DOH! Just saw the rest of your message Gareth! Was going to do a blue tunic but as Kali already had, thought I'd give him a different look. Perhaps he could wear the red for special occasions ;D ;D ;D
Cazza
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Okay, I started having visions of the guy loosing his pants as he was coming down the emergency pole :P :P, so here he is with belt and a new ensemble! ;D ;D
Cazza
;D ;D
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nice one cazza, but i did like his red coat its a shame & i think they should have worn them red.
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And cos Pippa liked the red one, here he is with belt ;D
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Cheers Kali ;D
I agree ...he's a much more dashing figure in red!! ;D
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I reckon they chose blue because in real life whan fighting flames they wouldnt have been able to see them in a darkened room full of smoke and flames. Its one reason why we changed from black helmets to yellow ones, I remember the yellow paint arriving, it was so hilarious to see all these old firemen painting their helmets yellow, they were so grumpy, and looked like a row of daffodils on parade LOL, takes me back to 1976!
More black on helmet and belt Id suggest if you want to get closer to real life. Not that im critical as I cant do it! Red I ask you!
Gareth just retired after 32 yrs hooray.
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Gareth
In honour of your retirement, very quickly one black looking belt!
;D ;D ;D
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Well done Cazza thats far more accurate now I think. Great!
regards Gareth
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Thank you everybody for your comments and the pictures.
Gareth as a fireman, can you tell me anything about the date of the uniform? I was going to ask about the odd looking tool attached to the belt, but I see that you have already had a guess as to what it was.
As to the dog, I hadn't thought about it being a 'mascot', I just assumed it was the pet of the fireman.
I can't find any history about the Chester fire brigade, which I feel this man must have been in. I wonder if the Record Office would have any information, must take a trip to Chester.
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Hi Pippa,
I googled it and found a description of the Chester volunteer fire brigade
and a photo. Be careful, there is also a Chester fire bigade in New Zealand that
also throws up old information and photo's.
Tomkin
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Thanks for your comments Tomkin, that's interesting maybe Pippa has relatives in NZ? As for the date Pippa the photo looks old enought to be pre 1890 to me however that would almost certanly have meant a brass helmet.
I think that as he has this black one I'd say around 1900-1920 but maybe Im wrong but st least the turn of the century. I would be asking the other family members if one of them still has it as that does happen, passing it down, etc. Ive just passed mine onto my grandson he was well chuffed.
Amongst your options I would advise you to contact either the fire museum at Sheffield and show them the photo or the fire museum in London, sorry I dont have addresses but maybe a Google apround could provide that for you.
Another alternative is to surf ebay for old postcards of firemen, you may get a dated postcard which provides an indication. Head for one of the museums.
Gareth
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Erm...as for a date:
Hi Pippa :)
Thanks for scanning the back.
The photo most probably dates from the early 1870s - is that any help in trying to find out who it is?
Prue
It's definitely not 1900s or even close.
Prue
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If you look back you'll see I established when the chap was in Chester, and a period when he was documented at the address - so late 1860s at earliest ... 1871 onward deffo ...
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As it happens, a member of my family did go to New Zealand in 1875, but I think this photo was taken in Chester, England. It is possible that it was this Fireman that emigrated. If this is the case, then none of his living descendants knew he had been a Fireman, so nothing, like a helmet, has been passed down. Pity. Also it would mean that the date of late 1860s or 1870s for the phot fits in with this. So I am now beginning to get an idea of who this might be in the photo. But his occupation was a Millwright, so he must have been a part-time fireman, which I suppose might have been the case.
Thank you everybody for your help. I will now get my New Zealand relatives (recently discovered via RootsWeb!) involved and see what we can come up with as to his identity. I was hoping it was my great grandfather, but it looks as if it might have been his brother (the one who emigrated).
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Where abouts is Chester in New Zealand? My relative went to Timaru, North Island. Is it near there?
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Hi Pippa,
The New Zealand one was formed in the early 1900's if my memory is correct.
The Chester one was a volunteer force. They are all stood in front of a building which
proclaims this several times.
From what you say the England one fits. I only mentioned the NZ connection to try
and spare you confusing the two,
Tomkin ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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As well as your other searches, look at:-
www.Cheshirehistory.org.uk/VCH.htm
Tomkin,
;D ;D ;D If you are not used to this, just double left click on
the link with your mouse button
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Hi, William Speed is in directories at Grosvenor Street from 1864-1883. Ron Cosens
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Hi, William Speed is in directories at Grosvenor Street from 1864-1883. Ron Cosens