RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (North Riding) => Topic started by: JosiahS on Thursday 17 August 06 16:06 BST (UK)
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My GGG grandfather was born in Low Row, Swaledale which lies within Grinton parish, (or possibly Muker Chapel of Ease), but I cannot find his christening at all.
He was married in Whitburn, Co Durham on 1 March 1801 so he was probably born about the 1770s.
On the IGI there are 17 Miller marriages in Grinton between 1769 and 1860, 11 of which are men, but there are only 2 christenings, one in 1822 and one in 1842.
Where are all the other children?
Is this an indication that they were non-conformist so while obliged to marry in the CoE they could christen where they wanted??
If so, where can I find the non-conformist registers for Swaledale??
Your assistance is welcome as ever!
Cheers
Jos
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Jos:
The information you need is available on the upperdalesfhs website.
You will need to join.
It is free.
It is also very good!!
My records show 4 baptisms at Low Row for Miller:
10/03/1815 William son of Jas and Mary Miller of Birdnest
10/10/1819 Ann dau of James and Mary Miller of Birdnest
18/12/1823 Alice dau of James and Mary Miller of Healaugh
08/01/1826 John son of James and Mary Miller of Healaugh
And one baptism at Keld:
03/06/1792 John son of George and Jane Miller of Hartlakes
but there are 20+ baptisms at Askrigg for Miller between the dates you quote and Askrigg is not far from Grinton.
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Thank you for that and for the pointer to the website.
I had noticed the christenings in the 1800s but they are too late for my George - I also noticed that there are very few Millers in the 1841 census.
By chance our family has come full circle - George Miller moved to Sunderland from Swaledale and then 20 years ago our family moved back from Sunderland to Askrigg!! I realise that it is very close to Grinton but it is a different dale. On the christenings of George Miller's children in Sunderland it shows his 'parish' as being Low Row on the first two and then Reeth on all the others.
I'll check out the website - thanks again
JoS
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what names and dates do you have?
Miller tends to be interchangeable with Milner in Swaledale - and George is/was a common Milner name.
Christine
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pointe/4320
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Hi Christine
I'm a bit stuck on dates for George - all I know is that he was born in Whitburn just to the north of Sunderland in 1801. The marriage does not mention his parish but the christenings of all of his children do and it is either Low Row or Reeth each time.
That would put him in the 1770 to 1780 period I suppose.
His children - in order - were :
Marion/Marian
Mary
Jane
George
Mary
John
Mary Ann.
Clearly the name Mary was of some importance.
His wife Isabella's father was a Robert so there seems no obvious influence from her side on the names though I don't know what her mother was called.
I had a wander round the cemeteries in Low Row the other week when I was visiting Dad and I could find no Millers or Milners at all either in the CoE, or non-conformist, graveyards.
Why do you say they were 'interchangeable'? Is this the experience you have from your tree?
Any help or advise would be much appreciated.
Cheers
JoS
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Our Swaledale Milner ancestors were always having the "n" dropped, especially in the census returns although BDM entries usually got it right. The usual mistaken entry was Miller or even Millar throughout the 19thC. My uncle William Milner was known throughout his life as Billy Miller no matter how much he protested and some of my cousins are now Millers even though they were descended from Milners.
The thing is that Milner was the usual Swaledale surname derived from the Viking word for a corn miller. If you look on the surname distribution maps the majority of Milners are from the Dales. At one time the Milners were one of the 12 big Swaledale clans but they nearly all left when the leadmining slumped.
Cheers,
John Milner Stubbs
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Hi John
Many thanks for getting in touch on this.
As the non-conformist records are coming on line I actually think I may have found my George being baptised in Gunnerside by the catholic priest with parents George and Hannah who don't seem to appear anywhere else. If he were catholic it would explain why I've never found a burial in the CoE records in Sunderland (I found his wife)
I'll look under the name Milner and see if George and Hannah pop up
The odd thing is that after George moved to Sunderland my family moved back to the dales 15 years ago and his GGG grandaughter (my mother) is buried across the hill in Askrigg!
Ashley
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The information you need is available on the upperdalesfhs website.
You will need to join.
It is free.
It is also very good!!
I have ancestors from Arkengarthdale, which is in the area covered by the group. However, when I have visited their website it just says "If you would like to know more please email". Does this mean that I have to email a specific query to them, or email to indicate my interest in the group?
(http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Confused/puzzled-2.gif)
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Roobarb - I don't think so.
Dales Family History Society membership is quite straightforward and you can ask for regular updates on subjects you are interested in, ask a specific question and wait for answers or simply search the old messages for relevant info. You can be as involved or passive as you like.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dalesfhs/
They also have regular (I think monthly) meetings and lectures if you are close enough to attend.
Cheers,
John Milner Stubbs
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Thanks John, looks like I had the wrong web page. I've submitted my application to join and they will let me know whether they'll have me! Unfortunately I'm not near enough to join their meetings. Wish I was, it's a lovely part of the world.
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Hi Roobarb
I wish you good luck with it.
I tried it before and I just found it incredibly cliquey and mostly my enquiries were ignored while they all gossiped. You may have more luck
Ashley
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Ashley:
I am sorry that your experience with the udfhs group did not go as you hoped that it would.
As one of our members, Marion M, has pointed out:
I think that we must accept that we are all different, and it depends on how
narrow or broad the question is that is posted. The strength of this group
is that we encompass a great breadth which covers not only particular
genealogical lines, but the full range of economic, social, religious and
occupational history of "our" part of the Yorkshire Dales. Perhaps the
weakness is that we can only help someone with a particular genealogical
problem if another member of the group has a connection and has already
researched that line, otherwise, the knowledge is not there within the
group. I have not found a connection on this email list with my main
ancestors, but my word, I have learnt a lot about the lives that they led.
Likewise I have subscribed to other email genealogical discussion lists, and
have found one link on one, and absolutely nothing on another , but I still
"listen in ".
I hope that you will revisit us in the future and this time we will strive to be less "cliquey".
We have very many satisfied members of this group, both new to Family History resarch and recognised expert in their fields.
If we can you help with your research, and we have the information, then we will do so.
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I have been approved for membership and was rather upset that Ashley's comment was attributed to me by one member. It has provoked a lot of angry comments on there. Not the best footing to start off! Unfortunately my first post there has been to clarify this. I have said that I have joined the site with an open mind, which is true. I hope that I find the site more helpful than Ashley did.
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I hope so too - I certainly didn't intend to upset anyone, but having Yorkshire blood I speak as I find.
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I've posted on there now and things seem to be okay. I was born in Yorkshire so I understand what you mean, it's just a shame that it turned out like this.
PS Sorry to hijack this thread!
(http://www.smilieshq.com/smilies/sign0101.gif) (http://www.smilieshq.com)
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No problem Roobarb. Good luck with your research.
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George Miller also my ggg grandfather, his parents being george Milner (seemed to change to Miller after 2nd child) and Hannah Kipling. Would like to know what the connection is - mine is via john son of George, Alfred son of John and Fraances daughter of Alfred. She was my grandmother
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Hi Jlumb
Yes we are quite closely related - I will contact you by PM
Ashley
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:-\ it tells me i can't reply by pm
however we are in touch i realise by GenesReunited, and in fact was viewing your tree today, after a long gap since you opened it. will contact you via genesr
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Am searching for John Milner Stubbs ... I see that you had a family reunion in 2008 at Beldi Hill Mine .. I am very interested in the fact that part of Beldi Mine was called Jammy Milners Levels .. the reason is that Mary Metcalfe who married Peter Milner inherited fom her father William Metcalfe 1/ 8th of a mine called Beldi Hill Mine in 1766 . William Metcalfe lived at Calverts House Mansion and Calverts House Mansion was inherited by Richard Metcalfe who found a lead vein in 1770s and there was a terrible row about who actually owned the lead .
It seems quite obvious that part of that mine would have been inherited by Marys children ... She had James Milner in 1769 , Elizabeth Milner in 1770 , Peter Milner in 1771 , Margaret Milner in 1773 , William Milner in 1776, Edmund Milner in 1779 and Richard Milner in 1780.
Just wondered if there was any connection ? I can't seem to find any decendants of Mary & Peters children but it would wonderful if I could link up in some way.
I also found that a Palph Milner had something to do with Beldi Hill mine and when Mary & Peter were married Ralph Milner [ along with Richard Metcalfe , Marys brother ] was a witness.
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Hello Joolz,
Sorry, I seem to have missed this message completely. Please get back in touch.
John Milner Stubbs