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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Buckinghamshire => Topic started by: PaulaToo on Saturday 29 July 06 22:18 BST (UK)
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Denchfield family of North Marston Bucks.
Got most of what I want about them, but it's always nice to meet new members.
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Hi,
I'm researching the North Marston Denchfields as well and was thrilled the other day to discover many of them wrote wills which are now available online from the Bucks County Council. I've ordered a few, waiting as patiently :-\ as I can - takes a while over here in USA. Have you seen them? Just today I came across Gefferie's which is indexed under DeAnchfield so I hadn't noticed it before :)
Claire
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Hi Claire,
I'm not surprised that Gefferie had an A in his name, that was how they began. It only seems to become Denchfield after Gefferie, Richarde and the Baptism entry for Matthie, son of Richarde mar 7 1600/01
I haven't any Denchfield wills yet, I've been a bit busy with another branch of the family.
Now I know about it, I think Gefferie's is a must.
All the best
Paula
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Hi Paula :)
One nice thing about finding the online wills index for Bucks is that I got the year of the elder John's death which was missing from the torn up North Marston registers. His will went to probate in 1689. This is the John who was born in 1639 and was married to Parnell (possibly nee Ingram). He was an ironmonger. I'll let you know what other interesting tidbits I find when the wills arrive in the mail. :)
Cheers
Claire
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Brilliant Claire, that would be so helpful.
Thank you so much.
Paula
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hi paula,
Also found Matthie's will :) It was proved in 1661. Going to be three weeks or so before I get it. I do have a question for you though. I've seen in other Denchfield posts that you have Richarde born abt 1570 as Gefferie's son. How do you know that? I have the North Marston transcripts and don't see his baptism, so i'm curious if you've found another source which does link them.
Thanks
Claire
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I have no proof myself, only trust. I rather suspect that the wills you have coming will be the proof we need.
There was a site by a splendid chap called Mark Warner, which had them all joined. Sadly the site is no longer available.
He it was who joined all the Caponhursts together. I took them on with a question mark beside them because I had not seen proof.
Then a friend managed to get hold of a couple of Caponhurst wills, and we knew where he had got his information.
I rather suspect he had seen the Denchfield wills.
His site was very good, and very reliable. I shall be very surprised if it is wrong.
See you
Paula
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Sometimes trust is all there is :)
I'll let you know what I find in the wills.
Claire
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Brilliant, thank you so much,
Paula
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Hi Paula,
Got Mathew's will in the mail today :D :D
Here is the gist of it as best as I can tell, given the will was proved in 1660 and I am a novice will transcriber.
I, Mathew Denchfield, yeoman of North Marston, being sick of mind but of perfect mind and memory, made this will on the 4th of March, 1658...
I give my son John the sum of thirty pounds, to be paid when his present apprenticeship is finished.
I give my son Mathew the sum of thirty pounds, to be paid when he reaches the age of 22.
I give my daughter Prudence Stanbridge the sum of 10 pounds to be paid within a year of my death.
I give my grandson Richard Stanbridge one Ewe and a lamb to be delivered within six months of my death.
I give my son Mathew my great Pottage whensoever he demands it after my death.
I give my son John my great [can't read this word, begins with a P] :( whensoever he demands it after my death.
I give my wife Mary half my house and land with half the appurtenances for the rest of her natural life after which it goes to my son Richard and his natural children.
He names his wife Mary and son Richard as joint executors. The probate is in faded Latin....but it was proved on 9 January 1660 and it appears that both Richard and Mary were present.
Incidently, having learned Prudence's married name, I was able to track her death down in the North Marston parish transcripts:
Prudence Stanbridge - buried 17 Jun 1680 North Marston
Cheers,
Claire :D
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That is brilliant Claire, thank you so much.
I love the bit about giving wife Mary HALF the house and land....
Makes you think they drew a line down the middle :D
Very grateful,
Paula
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Hi Paula,
Just got a package of Denchfield wills in the mail, and I'm having a mild panic attack.....Looking at John Denchfield, dairyman, who made his will on 9 Oct 1799, and it was proved a year later....
he leaves land to son's John and Richard, which I will copy out to you shortly, but he also bequeaths 50 pounds apiece to "each of my four Daughters, Namely Elizabeth, Jane, Sarah and Susannah Denchfield" major problem being I was expecting to see a FIFTH living daughter, my Ann Denchfield who married William Baker. YIKES
From the North Marston PR transcripts, I've got baptisms to John and Mary for:
Elizabeth 21 Jun 1762
Mary 19 Aug 1764 (she marries James Chantral, has a son John who gets money too, dies before 1799 when her father's will it written)
Ann 4 Apr 1769 who dies as a baby
Jane 13 May 1771
my Ann 17 May 1773
Sarah 2 Aug 1776
Susannah 7 Sep 1778
Hannah 18 Sep 1780 who died in 1795 before he wrote his will
Does this agree with your records? Is the North Marston register wrong? Or could John have disliked Ann's choice of husband and left her out of his will??
-Claire
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My transcription of the whole will:
In the Name of God, Amen. I John Denchfield of Northmarston in the County of Bucks, Dairyman, being weak in Body but of sound & perfect Memory and Understanding, blessed be God therefor do make and declare this my last Will and Testament in manner as followeth (that is to say) Principally and first of all I commend my Soul into the hands of Almighty God, and my Body to the Earth in hopes of a blessed Resurrection: and as to my little Worldly Estate I dispose of the Same as follows (that is to say) I Give and devise unto my Son John Denchfield his Heirs and Assigns for ever All that my New Inclosed Piece of Ground lying in the Parish of Northmarston aforesaid which was Allotted unto my late Father John Denchfield in lieu of a Half Yard Land then lying dispersedly in the Open and Common Fields of Northmarston aforesaid The Estate of Francis Lewis lying on the eastward part thereof and that of Mr. Eaton on the westward part thereof Together with all Rights Members and Appurtenances thereunto belonging Paying thereout unto my Son Richard Denchfield the sum of One hundred Pounds of lawful Money of Great Britain at his Age of Twenty one Years in case he so long shall live. I Give and devise also unto my said Son Richard Denchfield his Heirs and Assigns for ever All that my Messuage or Tenement situate near the Church in Northmarston aforesaid now in the occupation of William Buckingham; Also All that my Messuage or Tenement and Close or Closes adjoining and belonging situate and being in Northmarston aforesaid which I lately purchased of Mr. James Burnham of Winslow. Together with all Rights Members and Appurtenances to them respectively belonging. I Give and bequeath to each of my four Daughters, Namely Elizabeth, Jane, Sarah and Susannah Denchfield the sum of fifty Pounds apiece of lawful Money of Great Britain at their respective ages of twenty one Years provided they respectively so long shall live. I give to my Grandson John Chantrel the sum of ten pounds at his age of Twenty one years. All the rest and residue of my Goods and Chattels and Personal Estate of what nature and kindsoever I give and bequeath equally between my well beloved Wife Mary and my said Son John Denchfield, whom I likewise make and appoint joint Executors of this my last Will and Testament. In Witness whereof I have hereunto set my hand and seal the ninth day of October in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Ninety nine. (1799)
the estate was valued to be less than 600 pounds
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Hi Claire.
Well there's a turn up!
I have no doubt that Ann is his child, but I wonder why he left her out of his will?
That is very very interesting.
I've had ones cut out of wills before because they married the wrong person, so it did go on.
Oh dear.
Thanks for that, another problem to ponder. Still, that's what makes family history fun.
Paula
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I wonder if it was because William Baker was so well off. He didn't think he needed to worry about her.
I've moved on to transcribing the will of John Denchfield, 1689. Very slow going..........curiously, this is the John I had as being married to Parnell, however in the will he mentions his well loved wife Audrey. Also, he makes several bequests to his daughter Parnell who appears to have married John Stevens and had a son Ralphe Stevens who is John's 'grandchild and god sonne'. I had no idea there was a daughter Parnell.
I suspect his wife Parnell had died in the torn out years and he'd subsequently married Audrey. There is a death of an Awdry Denchfield, widow in nearby Oving in 1704 who could be the same.
Let you know when I've made some more progress!!!!
Claire
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That 'black hole' in the North Marston register is really annoying me!
It seems so much that we need happened on those lost pages.
I see Mary Chantral doesn't get a mention in the will of John 1799, but her son does...
Could it be that Ann and William had not yet produced a son... and they lost out?
I didn't know about Parnell dying, but if she went down the black hole and he married Audrey, that would explain the appearance of Awdrey Denchfield in Oving.
Very interesting
Thanks
Paula
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Hi Paula! :) :)
I'm in the midst of transcribing more Denchfield wills for my blog and a question from a long distant cousin in S. Africa (yours too I would think!) has got me puzzling over the Mary Gurney/Thorn/lambourn mystery again. Can I compare notes with you?
I've got Ann Denchfield (married William Baker) born in 1773 as the daughter of John Denchfield and Mary Gurney. Ann's father John was the son of John Denchfield (the elder) and Elizabeth Brewer. Elizabeth died in 1759, and widower John (elder) married Mary Thorne on 13 April 1773 - from the BHFS St Mary's transcripts.
Some online genealogies have Mary Thorne's name as Mary Lanbourne...not sure why. Also, some online genealogies suggest that it was Ann's father John, and not her grandfather, who married Mary Thorne/Lambourn in 1773, and that Ann is actually the daughter of Mary Thorne/Lambourn.
I have copies of wills for both Johns - Ann's father John who made a will in 1799, and her grandfather John, who made his will in 1766 (amended 1777). BOTH John's mention wives named Mary which to me is compelling evidence that Mary Thorne/Lamborun was married to the elder John Denchfield.
Do you have any thoughts on this? :)
kindest regards
Claire
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I believe that Ann was the daughter of John Denchfield 1737 and Mary Gurney 1742 for two reasons.
First is the fact that if John 1737 married Mary Thorn it would have been only days before Ann was born. That isn't impossible knowing the things they got up to in NM, but that is usually the Tattams and Franklins, bless um. I think the Denchfields were a bit too near to their Rev. Gents. to get up to tricks.
Second, look at the dates of the children.
1762 1764 1766 1769 1771 (then the supposed marriage but they carry on) 1773 1776 1778 1780 1783 It doesn't seem to give a break for wifey to die, chat up a new girl get her in the family way and have a wedding just at the last moment.
Burial of Mary Denchfield in 1817 at the age of 75 ... 1817-75 = 1742
Mary Lambourn? There is a Mary lambourn, but I have no idea how she became linked in.
I reckon that John snr thought that 14 years as a widower was long enough, and got himself a new wife.
Hope this helps, it's a very confusing time with John, father of John who was the father of John, to say nothing of two wives called Elizabeth and two wives called Mary.
All the best
Paula
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Thanks Paula :D
I agree with you about all of it, including that it was Mary Gurney who died in 1817.
As for Mary Thorn/Lambourne, maybe it's a transcription error, or maybe it was the wishful thinking of someone looking for the birth of Mary Thorn and coming across one for Mary Lambourn was "close enough".
THere is an FHL microfilm of the original NM registers - I'm going to stop my Family History Library to put an order in to rent it. Maybe the actual register can shed more light.
Thanks for your help!! :D
Claire
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I have a transcript of the register ...
Marriage
Mary Thorne + John Denchfield b o t p
13 Apr 1773
wit. Robert Ward and Samuel Denchfield
Baptisms
Jun 27 1742
Mary d o Robert & Ann Gurney
May 19 1745
Mary d o John and Darnigold Lambourn
Can't find Mary Thorn's birth, though I could well have missed it somewhere, and I wonder if this is the problem ...
Looking for Mary Thorn who marries John ... Can't find her ... register must be wrong here's Mary Lambourn, she'll do ....
Mary Thorn might have been living in NM at the time of her marriage, but could well have been born somewhere else.
Paula
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Paula and all
Eureka moment today!!!!!!!!!
Stumbled over the will of Mary Denchfield, wife of deceased dairyman John Denchfield of North Marston. Although she was living in Bucks at the time of her death in 1817, she filed it in Herfordshire for some reason. Got a copy of it today and she left money to all her children, including "my daughter Ann, married to William Baker." So whatever reasons John had for leaving Ann out of his will where not of concern to Mary. I'm going to transcribe the will and put it on my blog, but I am so excited I wanted to share the news :D :D
Claire
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Claire, what wonderful news.
Which leaves us with the question ... why did john leave Ann out in the cold?
Good stuff this family history, isn't it. Get one answer and find another question ;D
Brilliant.
Paula
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Hi everybody :) :)
I'm still digesting Mary's will, but I just posted an earlier Denchfield will, John Denchfield, maltster, made in 1734. It brings to light a bit of mystery involving the link between this John and John Denchfield, the iremonger, who I've thought for a long time was his father. Let me know what you think :-)
Here's the link
http://mahoganybox.net/2011/08/will-of-john-denchfield-north-marston-1734/
Claire
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Oh lor, those dratted Denchfields!
NOW what are they up to.
You are right, it would be better if someone had given them a list to choose different names from ... it's all John and Richard and the brides names are the same in many cases so the daughters are named after them and ... Whew!
I'll have a look at that one when I get a chance but rather busy at the moment.
Also having trouble with emails, they have been on and off for over a week now. Getting a bit peeved about that to say the least!
By the way, I've put up some photos of North Marston is you would like to see them. There will be some more when the son and heir gets his developed, but there is quite a nice little collection already.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,546570.0.html
Cheers
Paula
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Firstly thank you to everyone for all your hard work and for sharing this valuable information. I am working on the John Denchfields and would be most grateful if you were able to kindly clarify if I have the lineage correct as despite reading the information several times, I am not sure I have it correct. It states there were 2 Johns that were cousins, so I want to ensure I have it listed correctly.
My link is via Mary Denchfield (born 1748?) married to William Smith in 1763. I have her parents as John m to Elizabeth Brewer, his parents as John m to Elizabeth Purchas and his parents as John m to Parnell Ingram and then Audrey, and his parents as Matthew m to Mary Spencer. Would anyone be able to confirm if I have this correct. Ive read the info here and on mahogony that the Mary daughter of John/Elizabeth Brewer married someone else! So despite reading several times Im still confused as to the correct lineage. Much appreciated. Kind regards.
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Hi Caroll!
Your email prompted me to take a new look at these Denchfields. I'm concerned about your Mary. What evidence do you have that John and Elizabeth Brewer's daughter Mary married William Smith. Maybe if I start there I can figure out why I'm showing her married to someone else.
Claire
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I have Mary (1748) daughter of John and Elizabeth, married to David Warr born 1747.
They married 9th Sept 1771 in St Mary's North Marston.
I could find no more about David.
If you would like to go back from Mathew Denchfield, try Richarde Denchfield (1570) married Margaret Ingram (1587) in 1601 at St Mary's North Marstom. His father was Gefferie Denchfield (1550) The line runs cold for me there. I have no record of a wife for Gefferie.
Hope this helps
Paula
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Thanks so much for getting back to me. I think I've made an error in the Mary - so its probably not the same one at all! Im revisiting it all.
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Hi Paula! Wow, it's been years! I concur with Mary marrying David Warr. She died two weeks after giving birth to her second (i think) child. Both her children died in infancy or were stillborn. David shows up in a 1798 land tax exemption report, where he is listed as the occupier of Rev. Denchfield's farm. I haven't looked for him beyond that.
Claire
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I don't gp any further than Mary, Claire. I tend to only do the direct line. If I didn't I'd have more than a tablecloth sized family tree.
I still haven't made any progress in finding where the Rev Ric Purchas came from. He and wife Ruth had children Sarah and Matthew somewhere, they died in Winslow 1687 and 1680. While in Winslow Rev Ric and wife Ruth had Richard, Ruth and Elizabeth who went on to marry John Denchfield. Rev Ric was not married in Winslow and neither he nor Ruth were born there. Would love to know where they came from. There was a Rev John Purchas, vicar of St James the Great, Bierton in 1561, but that's 100 years adrift. I can't seem to find anyone nearer.
You're right, it has been years, but the Denchfields can still get us wound up and ready to go.
Paula