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General => Armed Forces => Topic started by: Greyhound on Wednesday 03 May 06 17:39 BST (UK)
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Could anyone help with the following,
I have a silver circular First world war medal (British War Medal) on the front is King George V and on the reverse Saint George, on the rim it has the following.
82. PTE. M. BURKE.RIF. BRIG. is 82 his Army number? and what does RIF. stand for?
many thanks
Steve.
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Hi Steve,
The RIF is for the Rifle Brigade,not sure about the number, I would have thought that it's to short to be his service number,unless some of the numbers have worn away :-\.
Mick :)
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Looks like this guy:
Medal card of Burke, Michael
Corps: Rifle Brigade
Regiment No: 82
Rank: Private
Corps: Norfolk Regiment
Regiment No: 203630
Rank: Private
You can download the medal card for £3.50 from the National Archives site http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
Rambler
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Thanks for your help,
the medal and writing on the rim is in perfect order, I was looking down the line of him being in an Irish Reg, but the mystery is solved. :)
regards
Steve.
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edit....must read posts in full....
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you need andys expertise on this,he looks like a pre war soldier with a number that small,and he was most likely to have been wounded/sick because hes been renumbered and posted to another regt,his victory medal will be named to the norfolk regt,mack
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Not an old soldier of the Rifle Brigade but probably of the Norfolks, 203630 number falls within the range of the Territorials for the Rifle Brigade which were formed from the National Reserve as Provisional Territorial Battalions in November 1915 - each started its Regimental numbering from No 1. In July 1916 (in common with all of the T.F.) nubering was begun from 200000 upwards.
Seven of these Battalions were formed in late 1915 and all placed under the Rifle Brigade banner, as the Guards, K.R.R.C. and The Rifle Brigade were the only Regiments with no Territorials. They had seperate Pay and Record Office from the Rifle Brigade and no men or Officers from The Rifle Brigade was placed in their ranks so had very little to do with The Rifle Brigade.
I will hunt through the medal rolls and find out what Battalion he was placed in.
Andy
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Andy,
thanks for your help, much appriciated, regarding the Army number, the only number on this medal is No 82. sorry I don't have any more info.
regards
Steve.
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Steve,
I have many of the Territorials in The Rifle Brigade medals, most of which are marked with their early battalion number.
I will check the rolls for you and see what we can come up with as a couple of these battalions left good war diaries.
Andy
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Not at home at the moment to check through the rolls but a quick check on the database on my laptop indicates that he may well have been in the 24th (Home Counties) Battalion.
This Battalion was formed at Halton Camp West on the 10th November 1915 by drafts from the Queens, Norfolk, Suffolk, Bedfordshire, Royal Sussex, East Surrey, Essex, Royal West Kent and Hertfordshire Regiments, and was commanded throughout by Lieutenant-Colonel F.W. Burbury, a retired officer of the Royal West Kent Regiment.
It reached Agra on 25th February 1916, and moved on 19th April to Sialkot with detachments, at different periods, at Jullundur, Amritsar, Lahore and Ferozepore for Internal Security duties, and finally dispersed on 29th November 1919.
Unfortunately no War Diary survives from this Territorial Battalion.
Andy
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Andy,
thanks very much for your hard work, it is very much appreciated. this medal was given to me recently by my brother who found it as a boy ( many yrs ago). I have only just started to collect medals and I am amazed at how much info one can find out about them.
Regards
Steve.
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Steve,
OK found him, he was in the 1/4th Norfolk Regiment and then the 19th Rifle Brigade not the 24th, oh well, most of the Norfolks went into the 24th so it was an educated guesss at best ::)
His medal was returned for adjustment on 4/10/33, long time afterwards.
These territorials do muck things up a little and give you a headache sometimes, glad I do not have to research to many of them. Just waiting for Mack or young Harribobs to jump now as there was a load from the Manchesters.
Will post something for the 19th in a bit, need COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!.
PM me your e mail address and I will send you the medal roll for this gentleman.
One good thing though, the 19th left a War Diary and is about the most accurate out of all the seven Territorial Battalions. Funny though as the 19th was made up mainly of the Supernumerary T.F. Companies of the South Lancs, Loyal North Lancs, Kings Own, East Lancs, Manchester, Cheshire and West Yorkshire Regiments, The Royal Scots and the Cameronians.
Incidently, another strange quirk with these Territorials is that they have there territorial number on the rolls and then there battalion number until after the army changed its numbering system, so the later drafts just have the territorial number whereas the early members of the Battalion have both, shessh, just another complication ;D
Andy
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An example of the double numbering.
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Steve,
Medal Roll sent to you, hope it answers a few things. If you are having trouble with a 2/5th Manchester Regiment man as per your PM why not tap up Mack or young Harribobs, they might be able to help you.
Andy
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Andy,
look forward to looking at the medal roll, once again thanks for your help.
regards
Steve.
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Steve,
Glad that you got it.
Andy