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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Cornwall Lookup Requests => Cornwall => England => Cornwall Completed Lookup Requests => Topic started by: crowboy97 on Sunday 09 April 06 11:49 BST (UK)
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Hi all,
I am hoping that a keen rootschatter is willing to pursue this request please.
Last August debbi2k kindly located the following family at the 1851 census at Roborough Cottage 3, Buckland Monachorum Devon.
John Palmer, Head Male Miner 37 born Buckland Monachorum Devon.
Catharine Palmer, Wife Female 39 born Mary Tavy Devon.
Their two daughters Hannah Maria Palmer born 1840/41 (cannot locate birth) and Elizabeth Jane Palmer born 19 July 1842 in Horrabridge Buckland Monachorum Devon (have birth certificate) were not listed with them.
The 1861 Census locates the following at Liskeard (Pond Bridge or Cannon Hill) RG9/1529 Folio 58 Page 12 Schedule 9.
John Palmer, Head Miner 48 born Buckland Devon
Cathlina Palmer, Wife 49 born Mary Tavy Devon
Annie M Palmer, Daughter 20 born Breage Cornwall (unless birthplace recorded wrongly).
What I would like to establish is:
1. the 1841 census disposition of John Palmer and Cathalina/Cathlina Palmer (maiden name Vosper) and Hannah Maria Palmer.
2. The 1851 Census disposition of Hannah Maria (Annie M )Palmer and Elizabeth Jane Palmer as they were not listed with their parents. (I have marriage certiificates for both girls - 1861 and 1863, migrated to Australia in 1865).
3. The 1861 Census disposition of Elizabeth Jane Palmer.
4. The 1871 census disposition of Cathalina Palmer (John Palmer died in 1862 - have death certificate). She re-married in 1875 (have marriage certificate).
I hope this request makes sense.
Thanks
Crowboy
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Hi
Can't find them in Cornwall in 1841 . The most likely possibility in Devon is this family - I know it says Caroline but I have come across Catherine/Caroline interchangebility before. Worth holding on file anyway.
Cheers Jan ;)
Horrabridge, Buckland Monachorum
John Palmer 25 Labour Quarry
Caroline do 25
Nicholas do 5
Hannah do 3
All born in county
HO107/240/7 Pg12
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Hi,
in reply to question 2, there is a Hannah Palmer born Buckland age 13 a servant in the household of Richard Horn, New Inn, Sourton H0107/1885/305/14 which ties in with age from previous reply. Also, there is a plain Jane Palmer born Buckland with grandparents William and Jane Palmer at Lake (farm?) Tavistock on H0107/1883/110/10. Age is out by 2 years but gps might have made a mistake. Other sons in household also born Buckland like Elizabeth Jane's father.
Are these possibles?
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1851
John palmer,head, mar, 50, farmer, b. lamerton dev
jane, wife, 50, b. stowford dev
elizabeth j., dau, u, 19, b stoke climsland cornwall
mary h. j., dau, u, 17 ditto
hannah m., dau, 12, ditto
francis, son, 10, ditto
sarah e., dau, 7, ditto
john palmer, nephew, 14 farm servant, b stoke climsland
John gregory, servant, 21, b. north petherwin cornwall.
Living stoke climsland cornwall. district 4c page 37
ho107/1899
Thia looks like the family, with both daughters living at home.
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Hi Crowboy...Here is Elizabeth in 1861 ;)
RG9/1447 Folio 66 Page 47
The Temperance Inn
1 Lower Buckingham Place
East Stonehouse
home of Benjamin C Cross Tailor employing 12 men and 20 women and Hotel
PALMER Elizth J Servant 18 b Horrabridge Devon
Cheers Kris :D
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Hi again Crowboy.....Not coming up with much else. I think Hannah mentioned by osprey is probably right (Can't come up with another option anyway) and also in the same household as Hannah we have Keziah a 15 servant also b Buckland. (both House Servants...Richard Horn Farmer 66 acres 1 labourer - and Victualler) Now looking at 1841 I can see
HO107-0240 Folio 11 Page 17
Ridout's Lake
Buckland Monachorum
PALMER William 60 Y Farmer
PALMER Jane 55 Y
PALMER Samuel 20 Y Ag Lab
PALMER George 15 Y Ag Lab
PALMER James 14 Y Ag Lab
PALMER Kezia 4 Y
PALMER Elizabeth 20 Y
Now Jane seems a little old to be the mother of Kezia....Now looking at 1851 we have the same family also mentioned by osprey and it has a lot of similarities with the 1841 entry provided by janan also just a little worry who the children belong to :-\ Only possibilities I am coming up with and putting janan's 41 in here too they all appear connected but are they yours ::)
HO107/1883 Folio 110 Page 10
Lake
Buckland Monachorum
PALMER William Head 74 Mar b Bratton Clovelly Farmer 90 Acres
PALMER Jane Wife 66 Mar b Bratton Clovelly Farmers Wife
PALMER Samuel Son 24 Unm b Buckland Monachorum Farmers Son
PALMER George Son 21 Unm b Buckland Monachorum Farmers Son
PALMER James Son 18 Unm b Buckland Monachorum Farmers Son
PALMER Nicholas Son 14 Unm b Buckland Monachorum Farmers Son
PALMER George Grandson 11 b Sampford Courtney
PALMER Jane Granddaughter 7 b Buckland Monachorum
Cheers Kris :D (Not talking bout the footy :'( )
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I have searched every which way but can't find Catharine/Cathalina anywhere in 1871 ??? ??? Where was she living when she remarried? Have you found her remarried in 1881 - what does she give her birthplace as?
Jan ;)
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Looks like Reg in Plympton Jan. I have tried everything also and I can't find her either....Kris ???
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Not just me then ;D
Jan ;)
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Just found these in 1841
Horrabridge, Buckland Manochorum
Catherine Vosper 80 born out of county
in household of Mary Hodgers 60 Nurse
and a few doors away in same house but different household as the John and Caroline Palmer I found
George Vosper 65 Copper Miner
Ann do 50
John do 20
Elijah do 14
William do 7
All but George born in county
HO107/247/7 Pg11/12
Cheers Jan ;)
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A sincere thank you to Janan, Osprey, CookieCrisp and Krisesjoint for this terrific research effort. My initial goal was to locate Hannah in 1851 and Elizabeth in 1851 and 1861 with the rest being an absolute bonus.
From the replies, I am certain that the first three questions have been resolved.
Janan's last post with reference to Vosper's living in Buckland Monachorum is critical to proving the 1841 Census whereabouts and the interchangeability of Catherine/ Caroline.
George Vosper and Ann are Cathalina's parents according to IGI (as is brother John).
As Kris suggests it would also seem that the Palmers listed in Buckland Monachorum are all connected in some way and suddenly I am reminded that when you think the end is in sight a whole new scenario is presented with the additional Palmer and Vosper siblings and relatives requiring researching.
Janan,
Cathalina Palmer married John Axworthy in Plympton St Mary on September 1, 1875. I cannot decipher the Parish nor her residence at time of marriage. She died in March Q 1881 - therefore before the 1881 Census. Her birthplace is Mary Tavy according to IGI and 1861 Census.
I will try to work out what these localities might be and post a message.
Thanks again
Crowboy (not talking footy either)
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Jan,
Cathalina Palmer's residence at time of re-marriage in 1875 was St Budeaux. The last known location was Liskeard in 1861.
John Axworthy's looks like Tavistock Follett????
Crowboy
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Tamerton Foliot might work better!
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Sorry still no luck with the 1871 :'(
Glad you've got a few things sorted and some more leads :D.
Happy hunting
Jan ;)
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I've been having another look for the widow Palmer in 1871 and was wondering whether she was with some of her Vosper relatives. Couldn't find her, but there's a whole host of Vosper patriarchs - Abraham, Adoniah, Amos, Elijah, Ezekiel. Elijah is definitely her brother. There's a William with sons Eli and Enoch as well.
Interestingly, Adoniah and Amos were born in St. Budeaux - looks like some family link to this place possibly.
Elijah like his sister was born in Marytavy.
I've got the census refs if you want them.
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Thanks Osprey,
When you have a moment could you please pass on the Vosper references from St Budeaux.
I was not going to head down the Vosper path but the lure is too great.
Thanks again too for finding Hannah Palmer in 1851.
I think Jane living with her grandparents at Lake (farm?) in 1851 might also be the right one although as you say the age is out by 2.
Regards
Crowboy
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sorry to mislead you, the references aren't in St Budeaux, but of Vospers born there so I thought there might have been some family connection to the place. It was the wonderful first names that caught my eye.
all 1851 refs
Abraham H0107/1882 39 72 351 b. Devonport
Amos H0107/1882 109 5 24 b. St Budeaux
Elijah H0107/1905 39 10 41 b. Mary Tavy
Ezekiel H0107/1883 209 14 47 b. Mary Tavy
John H0107/1882 140 66 345 b. St Budeaux
1871
Adoniah rg10/2139 94 17 101 b. St Budeaux - he's a naval pensioner so I assume at sea earlier.
I wonder why John was just John and not something far more Old Testament or perhaps there was some sort of religious revival that influenced their parents' choices. They did rather stand out in the census index. Didn't help me find the widow Palmer though. Perhaps she's staying a married niece and wrongly indexed?
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Hi
Like you Osprey I think Catherine must be staying with a married relative and is wrongly indexed or even entered under wrong surname in census itself - that happened to one of mine in 1881, took me ages to track her down ::)
Jan ;)