RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Sussex => Topic started by: Little Else on Monday 13 February 06 20:05 GMT (UK)
-
My family Robins and Burchetts lived in Warbleton and Punnetts Town. I think they were non conformists - the IGI lists my great, great grandfather's baptism as being in an Independent Non Conformist Chapel, Heathfield. I know there is a Wesleyan Chapel in Broad Oak, Heathfield and a Baptist Chapel in Turners Green, Warbleton. How do I find out if they were Methodists or Baptists? My great grandfather attended the Bethel Chapel in Rye which I think is Baptist. I don't know where any of my family are buried.
Thanks Kirsty
-
Kirsty
Hi,
I think the Independent Non Conformist Chapel at Heathfield you refer to is Bretheren. They are very similar to Baptists. It is a large white chapel at Chapel Cross just before you enter Punnetts Town on the Heathfield to Hastings via Punnetts Town and Dallington road.
My family who also lived in the area were also non conformists and from what I can gather there were lots of very small chapels dotted around, as you say there was in Turners Green, there was also one at Earls Down where I believe some of my family went and also a chapel at Dallington. There is also a Baptist Chapel at Broad Oak, still there today.
Someone will probably correct me but I think they were more likely to be baptists/brethren in that area because they seem more prevalent. There aren't many Methodists around there.
Who knows perhaps our ancestors worshipped together!!
Kerry
-
Some of mine were probably in the congregation too! I have baptisms at Broad Oak and Heathfield Independant,
I was waiting for someone to answer this post because I wasn't sure but thought they were Baptists.
I found on Genuki an extract from Kelly's Directory which says there was 'an Independant Chapel and a Baptist Chapel' at Heathfield
http://homepages.gold.ac.uk/genuki/SSX/Heathfield/index.php
so am really none the wiser ???
-
Hi again
I have just looked at the oldmaps.co.uk map for 1878 and the Turners Green chapel is labelled Baptist chapel (Calvinistic - which is a branch of Baptists) the one at Chapel Cross is labelled Congregational. The only chapel I can find at Broad Oak is an Ebenezer Chapel which is Particular Baptist (very strict and sometimes known as the Strict and Particular).
There was also a Methodist (Wesleyan) Chapel at Earls Down near Dallington. So there were Methodists around despite what I thought! Perhaps I should shut up!
Kerry
-
Yes it's all very confusing. I think my Burchett line may have attended the large white chapel (Brethren?). My Woodgate line went to the Strict Baptist Ebenzer Chapel at Broad Oak. Not sure where my Robins line went but I think they were baptists. I think the records may be at the FRC? I think their lives were very wrapped up in chapel going so our ancestors would all have known each other well I should think!
Kirsty
-
Hi again
I asked my mum who was born and bred in Punnetts Town last night about Chapel Cross Chapel and she said it wasn't brethren, it was an independent Congregational which is yet another denomination similar to Baptists and Brethren.
Kerry
-
oh no what does it all mean??
All this religion in my family and I'm not even christened! What would my ancestors think? So I definitely don't understand all these different denominations. Need to read up on non conformism I think!
Kirsty
-
I read something in Mark Herbers Ancestral Trails earlier today, here goes.
The Baptist Movement split in the 17thC into the General Baptists and the Particular Baptists ( who beleived that only a chosen few and not all believers would achieve paradise).
Baptists recorded births of children and the baptism of adults, because they beleived that only believers should be baptised and only adults could make that decision. Hmmm... Since Baptists baptised adults, and not children, you should take care in assesing the age of the baptised ancestor. Look for further evidence of age ie a baptism in an Anglican church or age at death or burial.
Most birth, baptism, death and burial registers were surrendered to the Registrar General and are held at the PRO (now National Archives, at Kew) in classes RG 4 and RG 8. The copy registers are at the SoG
Entries in registers class RG 4 (but not RG 8 ) are in the IGI. Few records survive before 1688.
After 1754 Baptists had to marry in Anglican churches and should be recorded in their registers. Baptist marriages became legal again in 1837 if a civil registrar was in attendance.
Baptist burial grounds were opened in the late 18th and early 19thC and many burial registers are held at the PRO. Some pre 1837 registers were not surrendered - these and post 1837 registers are held at CR offices, churches, archives of Baptist associations and Baptist Theological Colleges or at the following archives...
a)Regents Park College, Pusey Street, Oxford
b)The Strict Baptist Historical Society's Library, Dunstable Baptist Chapel, St Marys Gate, Dunstable, Beds
c)The Gospel Standard Baptist Library, 5 Hove Park Gardens, Hove, East Sussex.
Many other Baptist records are at local CR offices - some are held by the Baptist Historical Society - (there is a name and address but not sure if it's still relevant, will try to check)
Minutes of some Baptist assemblies survive from the 17thc, including the names of those attending. Much information on the movement but also about particular congregations. Church minute books deal with theology and doctrine but also membership, finance and charity.
Some include lists of members, where they lived and dates of members baptism's. Donations may be recorded in minutes or accounts, some chapels provided charity for members and the minutes may record names and sums of money for donations and expenditure. Also recorded are disciplinary cases (many for drunkeness and fornication) that were heard by chapel meetings, proceedings often resulted in a persons expulsion from the congregation.
Many church minute books are held at a) and c) above.
Thats it -
Suey
-
Robert Norden was one of the very early non-conformists.
NORDEN Robert Waldron 22 Jul 1690 house of R Norden registered for worship of Anabaptists Taken from a compilation of the Episcopal and Quarter SessionsRecords by the staff of the East and West Sussex Record Offices of houses which were registerd as places of worship for non conformist denominations
n 1714, Robert Norden of Warbleton, Sussex, England was sent to Virginia as a Baptist minister.
Norden was the first Baptist minister sent to America. His work is under reported but a great deal of the Baptist movement in the southern United States is a result of his family.
DNA research has linked up Nordens, Nordans, Nordins and Nortons as part of his family.
Here is a study on the Nordens of Sussex.
http://www.nortonfamily.net/fluvanna-sussex.htm
Here is a study on the Norton line from his family in Virginia.
http://www.nortonfamily.net/fluvanna.htm
I am looking for more info on the Baptists of Sussex.
Scott Norton
-
Hi Scott
Interesting website and I will keep a look out for any Nortons. I have recently turned to looking at my Harmer family who came from the Warbleton/Old Heathfield area in the 1500s.
I'll let you know if I find any Nordens.
Kerry
-
Kirsty
If this was the Cade Street Independent, then they were not anything in particular. It was apparently set up by George Gilbert (28-4-1741 to 23-3-1827).
"A wild, reckless and immoral soldier he was converted to 'Methodism' in 1766 and soon after became overseer of the workmen on the estate of his commanding officer, by now Lord Heathfield, at Heathfield Park. "
That was taken from Errey: Roots Branches and Leaves by Neil Errey, ISBN 0 9592787, Adelaide, Australia, 1982. I believe it is attributed to "Whe Worthies of Sussex" by M.A. Lower.
There is a lot more information in the book on George Gilbert and I guess the source, so I will not type it here. The HIC (Heathfield Independent Church) featuress heavily in the Errey Book and the author assumes/suggests it is the same one set up by George Gilbert. Some Errey women married Gilberts (unsure if related to George Gilbert). There are lots of mentions of the role of the HIC in Neil's book. It also mentions that the Errey's that came to Australia were not opposed to establishing their own, unconnected chapels.