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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: trish on Sunday 18 January 04 06:01 GMT (UK)
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Hello,
I have been do my family research . The Newton family came to New Zealand in 1859 on board the ship ' Mystery' from Deal Kent U.K. My G/G/Grandfather was Edward prebble Newton and G/G/Grandmother was Sarah [Fithall] they married in Kent [i think] but dont know what year. I have their children's name's but would like to know at what parish Edward and Sarah married. Also Sarah's family if their were any sister's or brother's . Thankyou if you can help.
pat newton.
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Dear Pat,
Can you tell me what year Edward or Sarah were born and if possible the year their eldest child was born.
If we have this information it may help narrow our search.
Regards
Sarah
Admin :)
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Edward was 30yrs when he came to New Zealand so he was born about 1828. Their children are .
joseph Edward born 1854 England.
James Henry born 1855 England.
Henry born 1858 England.
Maria Dorcas born 1860 Lyttelton N.Z.
Edward Henry born 1862 Christ Church N.Z.
Sylvester John born 1864 Ch-Ch N.Z.
Charles Deal parsmore born 1867 Ch-Ch N.Z.
George prebble born 1871 Timaru N.Z.
Matilda Jane born Timaru twin to George .
Thankyou pat newton.
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Hello Sarah.
I was wondering how you are geting on with my family research. I believe Edward's father's name was Isaac I dont know about his mother . Edward's brother John came to N.Z. on the same ship as he did. They were both Mariner's.
Thank's for any other help you can give. ::)
pat [ or trish ].
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Hello Trish,
Looking at your enquiry it appears to be eight months since anything happened here.
Did you receive a PM between January and now ?
Christopher
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Hello,
I have been do my family research . The Newton family came to New Zealand in 1859 on board the ship ' Mystery' from Deal Kent U.K. My G/G/Grandfather was Edward prebble Newton and G/G/Grandmother was Sarah [Fithall] they married in Kent [i think] but dont know what year. I have their children's name's but would like to know at what parish Edward and Sarah married. Also Sarah's family if their were any sister's or brother's . Thankyou if you can help.
pat newton.
Pat, Edward Prebble Newton is my 3rd great-grandfather. Were you able to find out more information about his family ?
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Edward Prebble Deal Newton was baptised at St George's church, Deal on 21/1/1829, one of 11 children of James & Jemima Newton, Mariner of North Street.
The three children baptised at St Andrew's church, Deal were Joseph Edward, 7/7/1854 while stll at North Street, Jem 16/4/1856 while living at Ark Lane and Henry 24/3/1858 when James was a Labourer living at Lower Street, now the High Street.
Have not found any record of Edward's marriage or of Sarah Fittall, implying hat she came from out of the parish and that they were married there.
Hope this is of some small help.
regards
AJ
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Marriage Reg FreeBMD;
Sept 1853, Eastry, 2a 923
Sarah FITTALL/FITTLE and Edward Prebble NEWTON
Trish :)
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1851 Census Sarah appears to be in Kent with her widowed Mother;
Susannah Fittell 48
Sarah Fittell 19 born Gt Mongeham, Kent
George Fittell 12
Joseph Fittell 9
Ellen S Fittell 5
Bapt 5 Feb 1832 Great Mongeham to GEORGE/SUSANNA Fittall
Susannah Fittall died 1895 age 94, good age!
1841 Census
George Fettall, 35, Ag Lab
Susannah Fettall, 35
Robert Fettall, 11
Sarah Fettall, 9***
George Fettall, 3
Birth Reg Gro Index;
FITTEL, ELLEN SMITH, Mothers maiden name MOON*****
GRO Reference: 1846 D Quarter in EASTRY UNION Volume 05 Page 151
SUSANNA Moon christening:4 December 1803, Deal, Kent to THOMAS/SARAH
Marriage of Susannah MOON to George FITTALL 14 October 1828, Great Mongeham, Kent
Trish :)
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Possible Marriage for Susannahs Parents;
9 April 1797,Deal, Kent, Thomas MOON to Sarah BROUGHTON
Burial;
George SMITH: age 45 (1803)
19 September 1848 Great Mongeham, Kent, England, United Kingdom
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Expanding on what trish1120 has so helpfully provided, Sarah Fittall was baptised in Great Mongeham (village just outside Deal) on 5/2/1832 to George & Susanna Fittall, Labourer, one of 6 children. George married Susanna Moon in Great Mongeham on 14/10/1828, Robert and Henrietta Fittall were witnesses.
Regards
AJ
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Update on Newton emigrants:
Edward Newton sailed on the White Star Line ship 'Mystery' 1069 tons from London to Lyttleton, New Zealand departing 15 December 1858 arriving Lyttleton 20 March 1859.
There were two families of Newtons:
John Henry Newton 32 Mariner of Deal
Jane 32
John Henry 7
Rachel A 5
Isaac 3
William R 1
Edward Newton 30 Mariner of Deal (St Andrew's)
Sarah 27
Joseph Edward 4
James Henry 3
Henry 9 months
They sailed in company with other Deal Mariners and their families: Bowbyes, Bowles, Clayson, Cory, Roberts, Rogers, wilds and Wyman.
AJ
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Update on Newton emigrants:
Edward Newton sailed on the White Star Line ship 'Mystery' 1069 tons from London to Lyttleton, New Zealand departing 15 December 1858 arriving Lyttleton 20 March 1859.
There were two families of Newtons:
John Henry Newton 32 Mariner of Deal
Jane 32
John Henry 7
Rachel A 5
Isaac 3
William R 1
Edward Newton 30 Mariner of Deal (St Andrew's)
Sarah 27
Joseph Edward 4
James Henry 3
Henry 9 months
They sailed in company with other Deal Mariners and their families: Bowbyes, Bowles, Clayson, Cory, Roberts, Rogers, wilds and Wyman.
AJ
Hi all,
Edward Prebble Newton was my 3xgreat grandfather. John Henry was his brother. Both brothers and their families were meant to come to New Zealand in 1858, on the ship MYSTERY but John's family had small pox and scarlet fever and were put off the boat at Gravesend, England They came instead in 1859 on the ship VICTORY.
Immigration
14 May 1859 • Lyttelton Harbour, Canterbury
S.S 'Victory' Gravesend (20 Jan 1859) to Lyttelton (14 May 1859) Sailed 20th January 1859 Arrived 14th May 1859 at Lyttelton NEWTON JANE 32 NEWTON JOHN HENRY 32 NEWTON JOHN HENRY 7 NEWTON RACHEL 5 NEWTON ISAAC S. 3 NEWTON WILLIAM R. 1
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Hello Kirsty
Thank you for the update on the Newton emigration. I had a vague idea one family had travelled later but I couldn't remember which one.
There were thirteen boatmen and their families - six Government funded and the remaining seven self-funded. The Newtons were the latter. Omitted from my list were the families of Gardner, Hayman and Wyman. They boarded the 'Mystery' at Charing Cross, the 'Mystery' making the first journey of this kind and under the command of a Captain Matthews. There were about 320 people on board from all walks of life.
She docked at Gravesend for supplies and for the last chance for passengers to go ashore. Some families were landed here as symptoms of smallpox were discovered and scarlet fever was spreading fast. She anchored in the Downs (off Deal) and called for help from Deal. She was there for several days before continuing her journey. This took over eighty days, a fast time, apparently, but by the time she reached Lyttleton disease has caused the 'Mystery' to fly the yellow fever flag and thus be put into quarantine.
Once ashore, the Deal families, amongst others were housed in the nearby barracks then set about unloading the ship. The self-funded families found immediate employment doing what boatmen did in Deal.
The self-funded boatmen established a fishery in Lyttleton in 1861 but two years later went bankrupt as fishing was not a familiar occupation for Deal boatmen.
Edward Newton moved to Timaru and became a fisherman. His wife Sarah sought a protection order against him in addition to custody of their children but both cases were withdrawn. After suffering some serious accidents, Edward moved to Gisborne, where he died aged 87.
John Newton died at the age of 93. He entered public service before returning to being a boatman for Lyttleton Harbour Board. He retired at 75. When he died he left 5 sons, 2 daughters, 28 grandchildren and 45 great-grandchildren.
Hope this is of interest. I have left out the details of the privations of the voyage, sticking only to the Newton-related facts.
Regards
AJ
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Hello Kirsty
Thank you for the update on the Newton emigration. I had a vague idea one family had travelled later but I couldn't remember which one.
There were thirteen boatmen and their families - six Government funded and the remaining seven self-funded. The Newtons were the latter. Omitted from my list were the families of Gardner, Hayman and Wyman. They boarded the 'Mystery' at Charing Cross, the 'Mystery' making the first journey of this kind and under the command of a Captain Matthews. There were about 320 people on board from all walks of life.
She docked at Gravesend for supplies and for the last chance for passengers to go ashore. Some families were landed here as symptoms of smallpox were discovered and scarlet fever was spreading fast. She anchored in the Downs (off Deal) and called for help from Deal. She was there for several days before continuing her journey. This took over eighty days, a fast time, apparently, but by the time she reached Lyttleton disease has caused the 'Mystery' to fly the yellow fever flag and thus be put into quarantine.
Once ashore, the Deal families, amongst others were housed in the nearby barracks then set about unloading the ship. The self-funded families found immediate employment doing what boatmen did in Deal.
The self-funded boatmen established a fishery in Lyttleton in 1861 but two years later went bankrupt as fishing was not a familiar occupation for Deal boatmen.
Edward Newton moved to Timaru and became a fisherman. His wife Sarah sought a protection order against him in addition to custody of their children but both cases were withdrawn. After suffering some serious accidents, Edward moved to Gisborne, where he died aged 87.
John Newton died at the age of 93. He entered public service before returning to being a boatman for Lyttleton Harbour Board. He retired at 75. When he died he left 5 sons, 2 daughters, 28 grandchildren and 45 great-grandchildren.
Hope this is of interest. I have left out the details of the privations of the voyage, sticking only to the Newton-related facts.
Regards
AJ
it is very interesting
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Hello Kirsty
Thank you for the update on the Newton emigration. I had a vague idea one family had travelled later but I couldn't remember which one.
There were thirteen boatmen and their families - six Government funded and the remaining seven self-funded. The Newtons were the latter. Omitted from my list were the families of Gardner, Hayman and Wyman. They boarded the 'Mystery' at Charing Cross, the 'Mystery' making the first journey of this kind and under the command of a Captain Matthews. There were about 320 people on board from all walks of life.
She docked at Gravesend for supplies and for the last chance for passengers to go ashore. Some families were landed here as symptoms of smallpox were discovered and scarlet fever was spreading fast. She anchored in the Downs (off Deal) and called for help from Deal. She was there for several days before continuing her journey. This took over eighty days, a fast time, apparently, but by the time she reached Lyttleton disease has caused the 'Mystery' to fly the yellow fever flag and thus be put into quarantine.
Once ashore, the Deal families, amongst others were housed in the nearby barracks then set about unloading the ship. The self-funded families found immediate employment doing what boatmen did in Deal.
The self-funded boatmen established a fishery in Lyttleton in 1861 but two years later went bankrupt as fishing was not a familiar occupation for Deal boatmen.
Edward Newton moved to Timaru and became a fisherman. His wife Sarah sought a protection order against him in addition to custody of their children but both cases were withdrawn. After suffering some serious accidents, Edward moved to Gisborne, where he died aged 87.
John Newton died at the age of 93. He entered public service before returning to being a boatman for Lyttleton Harbour Board. He retired at 75. When he died he left 5 sons, 2 daughters, 28 grandchildren and 45 great-grandchildren.
Hope this is of interest. I have left out the details of the privations of the voyage, sticking only to the Newton-related facts.
Regards
AJ
That is very interesting, thank you. I wonder why Sarah did that., maybe he was a big drinker. I think I have too many children then, you've said 7 children - I have this:
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Thank you Kirsty and oots. Kirsty, the names you list are the children of Edward, are they not? The 7 children belonged to John.
I can go further back to John & Edward's parents if required. That's where the Dorcas comes from.
AJ
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I've been fishing around the Newton ancestors and have found a query which someone may be able to help with.
John & Edward and their 9 siblings' parents were James & Jemima.
James was one of four children to Isaac and Dorcas (often recorded as Darkies, implying she or he had a strong accent that wasn't from Deal).
The puzzle is with James, father of John and Edward. Isaac and Dorcas had a child James baptised 31/12/1783 and Isaac had another son James baptised 28/3/1784 baseborn by the wife of William Gamon.
Logically it would be assumed that the first James had died but there is no record of his burial in any of the Deal records. Does that mean that there were, in fact, two James? In which case which was the father of Edward, John and their siblings?
If anyone has any thoughts I'd be pleased to hear them.
AJ
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Hi AJ,
How did you find that James Gamon was the son of Isaac Newton? I had not realised there was another.
The first James (baptised 1783) was I believe born 12 December 1781 and went to sea in 1791, aged 10 years. Unless I'm muddled (possible), he was the father of John and Edward and drowned at sea off The Downs in 1855.
Regards Eliza.
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Hello Eliza
These come from St Leonard's parish records. I only use parish records as these are the most reliable source, although errors occur even in them.
The first James could well have been the father of John & Edward but I was raising the query that there were two James by different mothers, casting a degree of doubt as to who the father of John and Edward was. The James by Francis Gamon's wife may have gone by the name Gamon or by Newton - it depended on who brought him up, I imagine.
Looking at the records again, there was a James Gammon baptised in 1784 but his parents were William and Jane, not Francis' wife, the mother of the illegitimate James.
Regards
AJ
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Hi AJ,
I am looking at the parish register images for St Leonard but cannot find the illegitimate birth you are referring to. The only one I can find on 28/3/1784 is for James Gamon (of William and Jane).
Am I missing something? Are you able to point me in the right direction eg) page number etc?
Regards Eliza.
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Hello, Eliza
Sorry, should have said. James baptism was at St George's during its first year of operation. St George's was opened as a chapel of ease for St Leonard's as Deal grew in size. It later became a separate church in its own right.
Regards
AJ
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Hi AJ,
Is that available online? I cannot find it. Can you give a link?
Regards Eliza.
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Hello Eliza,
I don't think it's available online. I bought the microfiche from Kent History Society and have typed it out so it's easier to read. I can give you any information if you need it.
There was a third church, St Andrew's which opened in the 1850's, I believe, and has some Newtons baptised in that decade. Again, I can supply any information you require.
Regards
AJ
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Oh I see. Thanks AJ.
There's a CD I can borrow I think from the local branch, so will have a look.
That birth sounds like it might have caused a bit of a ripple in the family. I wonder if the mother remained with her husband.
Regards Eliza.