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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Dumfriesshire => Topic started by: joyan on Tuesday 21 September 04 00:19 BST (UK)
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I wonder if anyone can help me? I have been looking for Nicholas Bell (female) born ca 1828 in Hoddam of Ecclefechan according to her marriage certificate which took place in 1849 in Liverpool her father was John Bell a Tailor .... and a witness to her marriage was Mary Ann Bell, could have been her sister.
If anyone has access to the 1841 Census or the Parish Records for her birth or baptism I would be very grateful because I have been stuck for some two years now on my Bell line.
Kind Regards
Joyce
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Hiya Joyce,
I'm gearing up for a library trip soon - had intended to go this week but work got in the way - how rude! ;D
So in 1841 you are looking for a Bell family in either Ecclefechan (my favourite place name anywhere ever!) or Hoddam.
I'll check the 1841 for these 2 areas and the baptisms from 1825 to 1832 - do you think these dates should cover it?
The 1841 census is indexed D&GFHS sell the booklets but I don't have them for these areas - I'll try the film.
If anyone else gets to this before me feel free.
Cheers,
Pam
;D
Cheers,
Pam
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Hi Pam
Wow! :D many thanks for replying I would really appreciate your help here, I think 1825-1832 would be the right time frame.
Going by her census details and death cert.
I have found her in 1851/61/71/81/91/1901 and all list she was born in Scotland but in 1891 it's Hoddam, Scotland and an elderly Aunt ( in fact she was 100 yesterday bless her) remembers her mentioning Ecclefechan and as these areas are in close proximity to one another I assume it must be either one or the other.
I agree Ecclefecan is a lovely name and sometime in the future would like to visit the area, I do hope that it is not to time consuming doing a blanket search of 1841, her age could be anywhere between 8 and 14, also thought I'd mention that one of her sons had the middle name of Irvine which could have been her Mother's maiden name .... just in case it helps a little.
I do hope it turns up something, you have no idea how happy it would make me,I really can't thank you enough for your kind offer.
Many thanks
Joyce
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Just as information, Ecclefechan is in Hoddom Parish. Ecclefechan grew substantially around 1800 with incomers from other parishes - farmers, cotton weavers etc. The old parish church in Ecclefechan contains gravestones up to mid 19th century, mainly indigenous families. A new church was built halfway between Ecclefechan and Hoddom, the churchyard containing graves of incoming and later families. There is an old graveyard enclosure at Hoddom with no surviving stones and a graveyard round Repentance Tower to south of Hoddom Castle. Although the new Hoddom Church burnt down the graveyard is still in use, and the grave inscriptions are mostly clearly legible.
Ecclefechan is fairly small, doubled in size by a Council estate, and contains two shops, a rather run-down pub, and a hotel. It includes Thomas Carlyle's birthplace. I stayed there for a week last year to do my own family history research (Murray- five generations), and there isn't much to do but go exploring - a substantial Roman Fort, Roman Camps and Burnswark Iron Age fort and Roman siege camps are the main attraction. Several bus services pass through it and it is very accessible by road (the motorway passes close to it), so it is probably best visited from a base in Annan or Dumfries. There is a good caravan park at Hoddom Castle for those that prefer that mode of travel.
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Hi Longshanks
That doesn't sound right! :-[
Many thanks for supplying me with the information about Ecclefechan I found it really fascinating to read! it sounds like an interesting little village that hasn't changed too much over the years and steeped in history too.
I just hope I can find my Bell connections there... then that will give me a good excuse to visit! it sounds as though your stay there proved successful with your Murray line.and maybe I might have a bit of luck so fingers crossed.
Thanks again.
Kind regards
Joyce
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I have just started looking into my family history in Dumfriesshire and have Bell's of Hoddam/Ecclefechan a few generations back, plus Linn, and even further back I believe there are Roddicks, Rogersons and Gilbertsons. There is a Mary Anne Bell there I think. I will get back in touch when I get all the names clearly in order, in case there is a link. Found the information about Ecclefechan now very interesting, I was last there with grandparents about 1950's.
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Many thanks for your reply regarding the Bell's of Hoddam/Ecclefechan I would be grateful of any details you have particularly John Bell a Tailor, Mary Ann Bell and Nicholas Bell ... do you happen to have the 1841 census for this area or know how I can access it?
Best Wishes
Joyan
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My most humble apologies - I thought I'd reported back!!!!
I have checked the 1841 and there wasn't a family that matched there were however lots of Bells who where weavers and cloth workers. I know I wanted to go back and double check because I was running out of time, but I thought I'd posted :-[
I will double check next time as it is easy to miss a name or two.
P :'(
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Many thanks Pam I appreciate your help and yes if you do go back could you please keep an eye open for my family of Bell's particularly Nicholas either in the 1841 census or Parish records coz I am well and truly stuck and have been for some time now.
Cheers
Joyce
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Hiya,
I can confirm there is no Nicholas Bell of any age on the 1841 Hoddam film. :'(
There are however many many Bell families so if you get anymore clues I'll happily revisit it.
Sorry,
Pam
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Hi Pam
Many thanks for trying to find Nicholas Bell on the 1841 census, she is proving to be elusive! I can't come up with any more details other than .. father John Bell supposedly a Tailor and Mary Ann Bell who could have been her sister or mother?
If when you next go to the library and have some spare time on your hands I would appreciate if you could check the baptism records between 1825 - 1832 but I do realise your time is precious and if I am asking too much please forgive me.
With kind regards and thanks again
Joyce
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I am being rubbish aren't I. I should of said, but the first time I went I did check for the baptism but she wasn't there.
Sorry,
Pam
:'(
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Hi,
I have a few 1841 census booklets from the area put out by the Dumfries and Galloway Family History Society. They list people alphabetically, (and don't specify relationships) which can make it a bit iffy to put families together.
There are a number of female Nicholas Bells in the "Annan Landward" booklet - which wouldn't be far. they include a 12 year old at 'Millside', but the head of the household looks to be a William, 37 yr old Agr Labourer. There is also a 18 year old at 'Newbie barns 8' whose father looks to be a John, age 58, farmer. There are also 25 year old and 55 year old Nicholas' - the latter the wife of John. The family includes a Mary, age 12 and several others.
If you search for the society you can probably find how to order the booklets.
My Ecclefechan area connection is to the Johnston(e) family, emigrants to Canada in the mid 1800's.
Jim
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For those not finding Bells or any other names in Ecclefechan in 1841 it is important to emphasise that Ecclefechan experienced a number of in-migrations as it grew. So the Bells in question could have come in from other localities. One of the industries that thrived there for a while was bacon curing, an activity in which Thomas Carlisle's brother engaged as a buyer. A number of the inhabitants, including my great great grandfather, took up curing bacon in outbuildings of their homes and selling on to buyers. My ancestor subsequently took on the coal merchant franchise, carried on by a son and grandson. There was also a cotton mill for a time. There are stories of gypsy families settling there, also people displaced from agricultural tenancy evictions elsewhere. My ancestors came there from Cummertrees after reorganisation of farm tenancies there. Even today, a substantial proportion of the population are displaced from other areas, mainly council estate relocations. Ecclefechan should be studied with this caution. The true indigenous population pre 1800 was quite small.
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Apologies to Sentance and Longshanks for not replying to the Bell topic sooner! with my husband being in hospital I have not had a lot of time recently.
I want to thank you both for your information regarding the Bell's, Sentance I will be looking into those booklets you mentioned and Longshanks yes I agree there is always the possibility that they moved into the area! perhaps I should look further afield hmmm!!!!!!
Many thanks
Joyce
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Just starting to search for info and possibly a sketch of David Bell of Eccelfechan, b.about 1788, and I believe graduated from U of E. He emigrated to Canada in 1832 (to Ontario),with his wife,Margaret Bryden b.1788 (possibly in Lockerbie), and several children.
His father was Walter Bell.
Any help or guidance is appreciated.