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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Kent => Topic started by: Pibrocher on Tuesday 15 November 05 17:47 GMT (UK)
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I am in hopes that someone knows the Woolwich area? Christening records of two ancestors (c 1822 and 1824) were found at St. Mary Magdalene there, but no marriage record. I have become aware that often parish churches could not perform marriages, that a Church of England would need to perform this. I would like to know of the name(s) of the nearest Church(es) of England to this area. (A long shot, I know, but other avenues are becoming exhausted!) Thanks so much for any help! Pibrocher from Canada
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I think that you are confused. The parish church is always church of England and St Mary Magdalene is the parish church. You need to look for a marriage licence to see if they were given permission to marry elsewhere.
The parish is in the diocese of Rochester and so there are two possible places to find the licence. In the parish or diocese records.
David
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Ahh--thanks much! David--I'd had conflicting information.
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As far as I can recall, at that time only Quaker and Jewish marriages were recognised apart from C of E - everyone else had to have a second marriage in an Anglican (C of E) church. Even until relatively recently, marriages in Catholic churches, for instance, required the attendance of a Registrar (my parents' marriage included).
Can you provide some names and any other information you have - I'm sure someone here will be able to help?
Dimps
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Just to clarify my comment. By suggesting looking for a marriage licence to marry elsewhere, I meant in a CoE church other than one in the parish of either of the couple.
David
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Again, thank you so much for your offer to help. Ancestors were Abraham ROBERTS (a soldier) and wife Alice. This info was obtained recently from their eldest son John's marriage certificate (in YKS). We found that John and (surprisingly) a brother Joseph, were christened in St. Mary Magdalene in 1822 and 1824 respectively. This is all new information; I had been hoping to find Alice and Abraham's marriage certificate or find them on a census in Kent but no luck (maybe since a soldier?). Vague family lore indicates that there may be a Welsh connection? and a stonemason connection? Stalled--any help much appreciated! Pibrocher in Canada
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As this is such an old request you may well have made some progress by now but if not ..............
Woolwich St Mary Magdalene
Joseph (born 24 March) baptised 18 Apr 1824 son of Abraham & Alice ROBERTS, artillery barracks, gunner Royal Artillery
John (born 8 Jan) baptised 27 Jan 1822 son of Abraham & Alice ROBERTS, Red Lion Street, gunner Royal Artillery
Casalguidi :)
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Casalguidi--
thank you very much!! Very Much!!
I hadn't been able to make any progress with this and it was a definite stumbling block, for years. This will help me find his Regiment and etc. I hope, and move forward.
Not sure where you've found it, but thanks so much--
Pibrocher
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Hi Pibrocher
My 2 X great grandmother married her first husband at St. Luke, Old Charlton and then they had children christened at St. Mary Magdalene, Woolwich and St. Alfege, Greenwich. Her husband was a soldier.
Regards,
Diana
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Jumping in on this enquiry but does anyone know the location of the actual licences for marriages in Woolwich circa 1808.
I'd like to get a copy of the licence or the bond which the couple had to complete to get one.
Thanks
Antony
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Antony, does this help?
http://217.154.230.218/NR/rdonlyres/1554807F-FBCB-4516-AC3D-61407A89C22E/0/7MARRIAGELICENCERECORDS.pdf
Casalguidi :)
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I'm not sure that it does.
The period I am interested in is about 1808, but this only refers to Deptford from 1875.
Would previous ones be at the Kent archive office ?
Antony
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Ok (sorry I didn't actually read it through). Woolwich came under the diocese of Rochester until 1845 so, yes, any surviving allegations/bonds etc. may be with the Centre for Kentish Studies at Maidstone see http://hereshistorykent.org.uk/displaytheme.cfm?pagetype=Guides&themeID=197&category=Marriage%20Allegations%2C%20Banns%2C%20Bonds%20and%20Licences
Casalguidi :)
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Thanks very much for the additional info.
Kind regards
Antony
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I have a baptism at St. Mary Magdalen Woolwich - 1802 I have not been able to know where to look for a marriage c1800 or before.. Might James Isherwood have been in the army or the navy - and how could I find if this is so.
I know he was'nt married in St. Mary M. He might have married in a barracks - or maybe St. George Hanover Sq.
Any help would be appreciated
Thank you
Joan
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Another church to look at would be St Nicholas, Plumstead (SE18 1HJ). This church is only about a mile from the site of the Woolwich Arsenal.
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Thanks Nick for that information - gratefully received.
Joan
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I have just found this subject and was interested in the link to the Centre for Kentish studies as an ancestor of mine married at St Mary M in 1795 by licence and I would really like to see a copy.
Went to the LMA some time ago but they did not have a copy.
Casalguidi if you would kindly send another link it would be appreciated the previous link did not work when I tried it today.
Kind regards Peter Russell.
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Hi Pibrocher.
I have the same problem as you. My 2xG.Grandfather (my brickwall) was a solder at the Woolwich Barracks.
We believe he may have been married before he married my 2xG.Grandmother.
The first marriage was in 1835 at St Luke, Old Charlton Kent. The two daughters from this marriage were Baptized at St Mary Magdalene Woolwich. The wife and two girls died in 1840 + 1841, and were buried at St Mary Magdalene Woolwich.
Then by 1844, he has re-married and has a daughter, another daughter is born in 1845 at the same time the first daughter dies. Both girls were baptized at St Mary Magdalene Woolwich, the first buried at Woolwich. I cannot found any marriage for them at all, the only possible one in 1843 has the wrong name for the bride which was in Lewisham.
After 1845 they disappear from all the census etc. until my Great grandmother marries in 1865 in Liverpool. We may have found his death which was in Ireland Portobello, in 1854(We don't believe he was Irish), stated as a Sergeant in the Royal Horse Artillery.
I have been to this site......http://www.nwkfhs.org.uk/char_plc.htm
Charlton, St Luke
Ancient Parish church.
Original Registers
These date from 1653.
Don't know if this site will help you but it's worth a look.
I did contact the Woolwich Barracks to see what records they hold and was informed that all the records are held at the London Metropolitan Archives.
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Hello - thanks for your message - were your ancesters named 'Isherwood' I wonder.
I am not sure if James Isherwood was a soldier, but his daughter Eliza married one James Morris
of the Household Cavalry..... I still cannot trace the marriage of James Isherwood and Elizabeth c.1800
Thanks for your thoughts....
I will try the London Met. Archives to see if he was a soldier ?
Joan
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Thread may have gone cold on this but am searching for Abraham ROBERTS. Found the bap record Feb 1794, son of Abraham and Ann ROBERTS, bap St Mary Magdalen BERMONDSEY.
Found a burial at St Mary Magdalen WOOLWICH in Nov 1794. Wondered if this is the same person? If so why bap at Bermondsey and buried at Woolwich as family didn't ever live there as far as I can tell. Anyone know about burial practices in London at this time?
Also does the symbol next to this (and other) entry indicate an infant death?
Scan on web page here https://sites.google.com/site/lazarusrobertshistory/abraham-roberts-junior/abraham-and-ann-s-children/abraham-roberts
Thanks
Rob